What is the the value of being a genius?

[Firefly]

Hi all,

New here and found I fit the bill perfectly.. So I guess I'm a genius.

If genius can be considered a talent then I am a genius at genius..

So what now?

Thought to go to college and do great things and found they taught things in ways that I could not stand. Concepts without integrity imposed by teachers without integrity. Before then end of the second semester I dropped out due to a shear lack of will. How could I respect the credentials gained if they were a lie? Why am I paying for people to teach me what I can teach myself better? Who in their right mind would accept those credentials and could I respect them for it?

All they could think of for motivating students was money and fame. I want to know. I don't care about the money or fame. I've been studying the mind for 17yrs so to master it and learn better. Not to feed the modern insanity.

How many genius's work daylabor because to get to the top in academics is to accept failures in Logic, Morality, Ethics? How many ditch digging geniuses are there because to make it rich is to feed the authority ouroboros?

Why is it I am so alone in this?

I love nature, I study every aspect of it and I have such ideas of grand import..

And I can't even tell my dog for fear the walls have ears. I have no friends I can confide in or use as sounding boards or be used back. I'm shunned by forums for not holding their truths but mostly I cannot find a forum worth posting on anymore. I have pushed all the buttons I could find.

This forum is another button to me but I would rather it a home.

...just rambling as it comes to me...

Where is the greener grass for a genius?

[Gurrb]

i feel as though i have written this. i'm currently in university, and i feel trapped to be completely honest. i've completed three years, and i feel no different. i've gained a lot of knowledge, almost none of it because of schooling; but instead, on my accord. i would've dropped out already if not for my family and their weight on education. i'd much rather dig a ditch and go home and read about things i want to learn, than sit in an office and waste my mind on prosaic mental tasks that better me in no way other than allow me to buy a big house to be lonely in (which isn't bettering myself, but you get my point).

academia and, unfortunately, most of society is driven by a powerful drive to be acknowledged and accepted. the people who are successful are those who stray from who they truly are--they assimilate. i too have never been able to find someone who is truly on the same page as me. i'm not trying to say i'm better than anyone, i'm just saying that it's difficult at times. in today's society (and i imagine any time in history) it's disadvantageous to have superior intellect or a clearer picture of reality. maybe the wool is pulled over our eyes for a reason and uncovering our eyes just leads to further questions and a downward spiral into thought. i can't just do things because others do; i need them to coincide with my beliefs. not to say i don't accept others' beliefs, i just don't compromise mine in doing so.

in order to have occupational success, i find, you need to appeal to people's ego--you need to suck up. so let's say i complete my undergrad, and move onto grad school. i need to work under a professor. i need to flatter this professor; do what they do, and pretend to enjoy it. i move on and get a job in a field i don't truly enjoy. but turn the page back and the reason this system works is because people tend to be egocentric; they want to be the [insert admired profession here] who is flattered (ouroboros, as you mentioned). they want the status attached to it. i've talked with many highly educated individuals and often their knowledge is limited to their field of expertise. even in their field, they are merely keeping the proverbial torch in the same place. they lack creativity or internal motivation to enhance or improve.

i know my writing style appears to be immature and unrefined (as many have mentioned on these forums) but isn't it hypocritical if i begin to adhere to proper grammatical structuring because i'm told to? anyway, i'm finding it difficult to convey my thoughts on how life and society is without writing a short novel here.

[Liberty Sea]

Hi there, Firefly.
Viewing from a larger outlook, you are not alone at all. Cases like you are pretty common.Young people who dismiss university became more crowded since the day of of Edison and Einstein, more so after Bill Gates and Steve Jobs.
We did not fail the system. The system failed us.

Things we do at schools have absolutely nothing with learning. At the age of 16 I have seen the impotence and latent contradictions of the educational system and wanted to escape from it, but held it off out of fear and hoped things will get better in university. But university is just as hopeless. There is no individual courses of actions in university and we have to put up with the career chosen by us in our frivolous youth or by our parents until the day we die. People who go to school not only get indoctrinated but also often are liable to the schools' manipulations, which is a blatant form of dogmatism and mind-control. The mind-control continues in the working life. Firmly tied to the system, you are led to being soly focused on climbing the job-ladder and repeating the meaningless, mediocre circle of life. After all, to do what is mandatory is easier for most people than to think for yourself as well as critically analyzing your own opinions.

But as cool as rebelling sounds, this doesn't mean college drop-outs are necessarily more intelligent than students. People who leave schools often look for an alternative. They unite into groups, which define their own teaching. They lapse, for example, into music or socialism or spiritual cults or counter-cultural and postmodernist movements. They wear the label of individuality and freedom on their tongues, but they often have a guru or leaders and simply imitate him. They wear the same kind of clothes, have the same opinions and talk in the same manner. Life get easier by imitating. A high level of mind-control
Rockers, skaters, hipsters, spiritual devotees, they are mostly all the same. Buddhist, Christians, Muslims, Atheist, rebels for rebelling's sake, in any time, any place, any regions in the world, they all run away from themselves.

As of what I have seen out of the QRS system in my 2 months old membership, I am not sure if it is any different. After several researchs I stumbled upon a website by Kelly Jones, a QRS follower. And basically she just repeated what has been told over and over again by the QRS trio.
As for the posting in this forum, it is not much different any other discussion forum. Many ridicule those who have different opinions from their own with hostile intention instead of good will. Many take sides and attack each other. Many are more interested in displaying their 'wittiness' instead of constructively contribute opinions and learn from each other. Many enter discussion with the "I am enlightened, you are not" mindset and leave no place for a change in their own philosophies. A genuine discussion is only possible is the participant enter it the purpose to find pout the answer together and not simply to defend their own positions.

Another thing I hate but am guilty of doing sometimes is quoting spiritual teachers from the past, an activity abused by many. To accept dead men or any other men as an authority and a source for confirmations, even those who claimed enlightenment and the way to enlightenment, is just as bad as any. It is good to recognize their effort, but it is better to put things in your own vocabulary.

So what are you looking for? A loving community that will accept you and your ideas? A place where you belong to? A higher authority and wiser people who will confirm your thoughts, recognize your genius and sweep away your insecurity? There is no such thing. The moment you follow someone you cease to follow Truth. Any kind of authority is destructive, and any acceptance of authority is mistaken. It doesn't matter where you go, which subjects you discuss, it is always you and your own authentic authority that are of primary importance. Treat others as your friend and at the same time your enemy, your teacher and at the same time your student. Kindly share your opinions, make every effort to understand others and make every attempt to get yourself understood, speak from your heart to their so that what you say can reach them, try to learn from them as much as possible but never idolize and worship them, and try to get from them as much as you can but never rely on or get attached to them. This is one of the central policies in my philosophy, which I christened Authentic Interspectivism.

To simply rebel against whatever society accepts is to remain in the mind-control of society. And it is easy to accept or deny a system, but the real, difficult challenge is to change the system itself, and to create a system that is firm but flexible, solid but adaptive, accepting but challenging. So here I am, a 20 years old who wrestles with his society to get to the very top, and will later use his power to turn it upside down. In the knowledge of its necessity, I stay with the educational system to change the very foundation of it.

Liberty.

[Dan Rowden]

I suggest you read the introduction forum then tell me if you still think you are a "genius".

[Liberty Sea]

I suggest you read the introduction forum then tell me if you still think you are a "genius".

I suppose your suggestion was directed to firefly. But I have not read it until now so allow me to post about my impression on it.
By that definition, I am not only an original/natural genius, but also a multi-talented prodigious polymath. An IQ of 160, I suppose, does not indicate my genius, but my (logical) talent.
But of course don't just take my words for it. My achievement will speak best.
Geniuses who are not experienced in 'skillful means' are often at the bottom of the job-ladder, sadly. So I am not going to neglect skillful means.

[Talking Ass]

Esteemed Liberty Sea, I am not deliberately following you around or anything, but it would be dishonest if I did not confess that I am 'trying to stir up trouble', or incite interesting conflict (I write fiction and Conflict is essential to good narrative). Please consider the following: when Dan [hello Dan!] refers to genius he means, and they mean, 'the specific group of conclusions at which we have arrived'. Honestly, they don't mean anything else at all. The most elevated conclusion is to become a GF 'Zen Buddhist' and refer to Hukinin or Hukanin (sp?) in your posts. That is real genius.

While I am no polymath and have rather dubious IQ, still I know all sorts of things about my barnyard, the various animals I share it with, the fields forests and clouds of my hillside above the ocean. While I never seem to grow (psychologically, spiritually) still I am trying and that should be worth something, no?

[Pye]

Young men, your criticisms and concerns over university/academy value do not fall on deaf ears. I could probably top these irritations and irrationalities with a hundred more hair-raising stories involving the human politics of the academy. But then, this here's the real problem: assuming there is an entity and a "they" that combine to create a singular situation and aim out of education. In doing this, one has already given-over to the assumption such a thing as an academy or a "they" actually exists, that "they" all have the same approach and aims, and that "they" are now in loose control of your lives. Get over this, and you will be able to see more clearly whether college education has something to offer you individually. If the specter of "it" rides louder in you than you, there's a problem.

Same thing happens when an academician thinks there's an "it," an "academy": they give everything over in error to it, too.

Just two other things for now: we're taught by people, not institutions. If each becomes a "they" to you, you will never be able to sow or reap anything one of these people just might have to offer you. You won't be able to hear an individual, but rather a false-paradigm - it will block your ears from hearing anything else.

And Liberty Sea, the wholesale social change you speak of in staying dedicated to your education will not come from the top-down. In other words, seeing yourself in a position of power (at the top) in order to effect the changes you seek is only to remain stuck in the very hierarchy you might be seeking to dismantle - not change, but a changing of the guard. Change comes from the "bottom" . . . one individual at a time . . . . promote individuality (the helping of people to the project of themselves) and the shape of humanity will change by default. Promote individuality and once one does, one cannot think lesser anymore of any other phenomenal being . . . .

[mental vagrant]

Esteemed Liberty Sea, I am not deliberately following you around or anything, but it would be dishonest if I did not confess that I am 'trying to stir up trouble', or incite interesting conflict (I write fiction and Conflict is essential to good narrative). Please consider the following: when Dan [hello Dan!] refers to genius he means, and they mean, 'the specific group of conclusions at which we have arrived'. Honestly, they don't mean anything else at all. The most elevated conclusion is to become a GF 'Zen Buddhist' and refer to Hukinin or Hukanin (sp?) in your posts. That is real genius.

While I am no polymath and have rather dubious IQ, still I know all sorts of things about my barnyard, the various animals I share it with, the fields forests and clouds of my hillside above the ocean. While I never seem to grow (psychologically, spiritually) still I am trying and that should be worth something, no?

XD

[mental vagrant]

Hi all,

New here and found I fit the bill perfectly.. So I guess I'm a genius.

If genius can be considered a talent then I am a genius at genius..

So what now?

Thought to go to college and do great things and found they taught things in ways that I could not stand. Concepts without integrity imposed by teachers without integrity. Before then end of the second semester I dropped out due to a shear lack of will. How could I respect the credentials gained if they were a lie? Why am I paying for people to teach me what I can teach myself better? Who in their right mind would accept those credentials and could I respect them for it?

All they could think of for motivating students was money and fame. I want to know. I don't care about the money or fame. I've been studying the mind for 17yrs so to master it and learn better. Not to feed the modern insanity.

How many genius's work daylabor because to get to the top in academics is to accept failures in Logic, Morality, Ethics? How many ditch digging geniuses are there because to make it rich is to feed the authority ouroboros?

Why is it I am so alone in this?

I love nature, I study every aspect of it and I have such ideas of grand import..

And I can't even tell my dog for fear the walls have ears. I have no friends I can confide in or use as sounding boards or be used back. I'm shunned by forums for not holding their truths but mostly I cannot find a forum worth posting on anymore. I have pushed all the buttons I could find.

This forum is another button to me but I would rather it a home.

...just rambling as it comes to me...

Where is the greener grass for a genius?

52men.58idu42tit07al sil-0.2ani35dut27idg6nol :: 50.255.5080.240.144

59eti.971erb415 30eg.n2459ä8l5 :: 122.182.17080.240.144

games without names lead the stray,
tame the number to remain sane,
pm me if captain alphabet is the name of this seeming game

[Dan Rowden]

Please consider the following: when Dan [hello Dan!] refers to genius he means, and they mean, 'the specific group of conclusions at which we have arrived'. Honestly, they don't mean anything else at all. The most elevated conclusion is to become a GF 'Zen Buddhist' and refer to Hukinin or Hukanin (sp?) in your posts. That is real genius.

To suggest that this is the extent/scope of our contribution to debate, or if you like our "program", is offensively stupid. Then again, maybe it reflects the extent of your capacity for comprehension, Alex.

While I am no polymath and have rather dubious IQ,...

Well, praise the Lord and pass the butter, I find myself agreeing with something you've said. What a day.

[cousinbasil]

Thought to go to college and do great things and found they taught things in ways that I could not stand. Concepts without integrity imposed by teachers without integrity. Before then end of the second semester I dropped out due to a shear lack of will. How could I respect the credentials gained if they were a lie? Why am I paying for people to teach me what I can teach myself better? Who in their right mind would accept those credentials and could I respect them for it?

Great things such as what? They taught you things in ways you could not stand or could not understand? So you, presumably younger than your teachers, not only are qualified to judge that every one of them lacks integrity, but the very concepts being taught lacked integrity? What college was this, exactly?

The sheer lack of will part I somehow believe. Let me clue you in on something: once you are faced with paying for these credentials that to you seem like a lie, it will not matter if someone is in his right mind when he accepts those credentials, you will respect the very smell of his shit if he pays you enough money so that you can get out of debt and get on with your life.

Dude - get back into school.

Where is the greener grass for a genius?

This forum could easily be a home for you, but you have to be honest. You are no fucking genius, in any sense of the word. No one here is. (Well, the jury is still out on Liberty Sea.) Welcome home, homeboy. Which is not to say you are unintelligent.

Two things, young man. Get help - no need to fight depression alone. Alone keeps you depressed. Don't quit things - join them.. Better yet, get them to join you. Fight back.

[mental vagrant]

If +4SD does it, then i'm almost in.

[Liberty Sea]

And Liberty Sea, the wholesale social change you speak of in staying dedicated to your education will not come from the top-down. In other words, seeing yourself in a position of power (at the top) in order to effect the changes you seek is only to remain stuck in the very hierarchy you might be seeking to dismantle - not change, but a changing of the guard. Change comes from the "bottom" . . . one individual at a time . . . . promote individuality (the helping of people to the project of themselves) and the shape of humanity will change by default. Promote individuality and once one does, one cannot think lesser anymore of any other phenomenal being . . . .

Individuality-promotion has been clamored in the West since the age of Enlightenment, and even at that point it was not new. "Why don't you judge for yourself what is right?" - asked Jesus, and look at what has become of Christianity. "Be a lamp unto yourself", those last and finest words were spoken by the Buddha in his deathbed, and his disciples listened not. Centuries after centuries humans are still ruled by herd mentality, and tread the same path over an over again.

Promoting individuality from the bottom and changing the system from the top must be a dynamic process, an organic whole. Otherwise it will always fail, as evidenced by history. To create a system that has more respect and nourishment for the authenticity of individuals is what I am aiming for.

[mental vagrant]

liberty perhaps you'll partake

[Firefly]

Liberty Sea,

You might as well have written it, you covered more than I cared to as if I wrote it..

You are the first shining star in my book. TY for posting.

.........................
Mental Vagrant,

Your game escapes me, how does it work? Looks like fun.

.........................
Cousinbasil,

Please treat me as I would you, with the benefit of the doubt. Innocent until proven guilty no matter how strange.

As for your questions in the order written:

Such as hard earned answers to problems not yet answered and some believed impossible. Think "grand" and let your mind wander. They are just ideas, my ideas. Relax. If I thought they were worth bringing up in a place like this I would have brought them.

Could not and still cannot stand.

I am older if not as old as my teachers.

Concepts have a different integrity than ethical or moral constructs, they have natural hierarchical foundations. Said foundations were negated for various reasons. Take Algebra for example, the common answer I received was, "It just is." next to, "The book says so." ... This by a teacher who said, "If your wondering why your classmate answered a question the same way you did yet I didn't mark it wrong, it doesn't matter. It all averages out in the end." This is just one of many such tweaks to the grading system he implemented. More students dropped out of his class than any other. I was the only one in class defending the students from his insanity and insults.

The college is just like the other three I tried, not your concern.

I never said I quit. I will try an Internet course next, my genius comes out in my writ and it is my last hope.

I fight where I see it worth the effort, when the ideological corruption goes to the top, you mus start at the root. The individual as one here has said. Was thinking of starting a genius school.

If I fit the bill this forum provided, I am a genius. Please show me where I am not. It thread will go where I wanted it to.

By this last, are you saying there is no point in being a genius? Just another pointless label?

Dude - Take a chill pill.


.................................
Pye,

You have labeled yourself our authority without authority. In this format you are a peer. Not older man/woman or elder. It is an inherent limitation of this forum and a freedom, please use it wisely. If one chooses to respect you as such then they may do so. This is the same for any forum though it is not recognized anywhere I have seen.

In other words your not old. Your fifteen like the rest of us. Get over it and tell us one of your stories please. I want to know more about you.

............................
Dan Rowden,

I have read all available information on Genius on this site before deciding to post plus the long list of quotes. When I found myself in all of it, I thought it safe to assume I am some sort of genius. I still do, it isn't some sort of destructive ego trip, I simply fit the bill provided that this forum is based on. Why do you assume I had not, probable cause?

You don't have to answer that. I can surmise you've suffered too many letdowns, by yourself and others, to have faith that the next stranger you meet may be Buddah, John Galt, Alex Rogan, Malcom Renolds, etc.

...........................
All,

I apologize if quotes are mandatory here, not to good with an IPad yet and working without a mouse for quotes is time consuming. If preferred, I will use my laptop or desktop from now on. I just love typing on the screen.
...

Will use the laptop from now on, can see where this can cause problems...

Keep it coming,

Firefly

[mental vagrant]

Hi all,

New here and found I fit the bill perfectly.. So I guess I'm a genius.

If genius can be considered a talent then I am a genius at genius..

So what now?

Thought to go to college and do great things and found they taught things in ways that I could not stand. Concepts without integrity imposed by teachers without integrity. Before then end of the second semester I dropped out due to a shear lack of will. How could I respect the credentials gained if they were a lie? Why am I paying for people to teach me what I can teach myself better? Who in their right mind would accept those credentials and could I respect them for it?

All they could think of for motivating students was money and fame. I want to know. I don't care about the money or fame. I've been studying the mind for 17yrs so to master it and learn better. Not to feed the modern insanity.

How many genius's work daylabor because to get to the top in academics is to accept failures in Logic, Morality, Ethics? How many ditch digging geniuses are there because to make it rich is to feed the authority ouroboros?

Why is it I am so alone in this?

I love nature, I study every aspect of it and I have such ideas of grand import..

And I can't even tell my dog for fear the walls have ears. I have no friends I can confide in or use as sounding boards or be used back. I'm shunned by forums for not holding their truths but mostly I cannot find a forum worth posting on anymore. I have pushed all the buttons I could find.

This forum is another button to me but I would rather it a home.

...just rambling as it comes to me...

Where is the greener grass for a genius?

52men.58idu42tit07al sil-0.2ani35dut27idg6nol :: 50.255.5080.240.144

59eti.971erb415 30eg.n2459ä8l5 :: 122.182.17080.240.144

games without names lead the stray,
tame the number to remain sane,
pm me if captain alphabet is the name of this seeming game

It's relatively simple. You have to figure it out and tell me the pattern. :: is analogue. Work that intellect like a 50c call girl, ride the camel to the grave :D

[Cathy Preston]

Promoting individuality from the bottom and changing the system from the top must be a dynamic process, an organic whole. Otherwise it will always fail, as evidenced by history. To create a system that has more respect and nourishment for the authenticity of individuals is what I am aiming for.

A system is the remedy for individuality.
@

[mental vagrant]

hey cathy, you showed up to offer your services? :P

[Pye]

Firefly writes: You have labeled yourself our authority without authority . . . . In this format you are a peer.

Sorry if it sounded that way. I thought I was expressing my particular views just as anyone else here, just as you say.

Anyway, you've just addressed more or less what I was expressing to you; you're already about winnowing this through no one's expectations but your own. That's all I was saying.

[Firefly]

Firefly writes: You have labeled yourself our authority without authority . . . . In this format you are a peer.

Sorry if it sounded that way. I thought I was expressing my particular views just as anyone else here, just as you say.

Anyway, you've just addressed more or less what I was expressing to you; you're already about winnowing this through no one's expectations but your own. That's all I was saying.

There is no sound here, just ideas permanently glued to virtual space in various formats. In other words I view it as a Freudian Slip. Writing is not depended on tone of voice, annunciation or volume; it depends on the constructs which we base our words on relative to their use. Cause and effect which I hold under terms not unlike Pan Critical Rationalism.

Why would I use someone else's expectations? Why not winnow through my hope? Hope for a better world, clearer mind and greater friendships? As peers we are self-authorities whether we like it or not, are good at it or not.. for that matter, know it or not.

First and foremost, truth is identified individually. This means knowledge is relative to the individual. Thus each one winnows this with no one's expectations but their own as any attempt to use someone else's expectations is to do so according to their own expectations first.

The question is "What do you hope to gain from it?" Want a friend to share ideas with? An enemy to challenge and be challenged by? To become a master of puppets? Or a puppet yourself?

Just need something to punch?

I'm all yours.

Promoting individuality from the bottom and changing the system from the top must be a dynamic process, an organic whole. Otherwise it will always fail, as evidenced by history. To create a system that has more respect and nourishment for the authenticity of individuals is what I am aiming for.

A system is the remedy for individuality.
@

Liberty,

There are many, thousands, trying to do what you describe here, some working together and some working alone in just about every system out their. Some don't know they are doing it because it tends to comes naturally. All of them together are keeping this global society from falling apart, but there is another, more effective way. Remember that the heads of the hydra are individuals too, you don't climb the latter for them to be so.

Work smarter not harder, right?

Cathy,

The individuality is already a system by nature. An Idea machine based on relative truths. Society is the system by/for that system. He's talking about finding and implementing a cleaner social system. Another patch if nothing else. Very noble.

[cousinbasil]

Cousinbasil,
Please treat me as I would you, with the benefit of the doubt. Innocent until proven guilty no matter how strange.

No one said you were guilty or even strange. In fact, your complaints seem commonplace - at least if you hang out enough around here, they do.

And don't worry - I have plenty of doubts. I was in fact hoping you would benefit from hearing some of them.

I never said I quit. I will try an Internet course next, my genius comes out in my writ and it is my last hope.

No, you said you dropped out - after giving less than a year.

The reason why I asked what school it was is because it does matter. I am aware that uni life has a profoundly elusive quality to it, like Purgatory. Here are all these people supposedly preparing you for life - but then what kind of life? One like theirs, rampant with inane politics and under-achievement and resentment that they never could make it out there? So do you believe them? You don't want to be like them, you soon realize, but you are paying all this money, and a college degree is the single greatest deciding factor in socio-economic welfare and success.

Also, I have said here many times I am no genius, so here is why I didn't pick up on your age. If you are soooo bright, you personal sojourn of inquiry could have begun at an early age, so that its 17-year span would drop you in your twenties. That would make your average professor older than you. And algebra was my strong suit!

Having said that, if you give it time, you just may find that one teacher who turns on the light inside you where currently is darkness. And you clearly harbor darkness.

I love nature, I study every aspect of it and I have such ideas of grand import..

I'm sure you do. If so, you probably won't find the grass so green here.

By this last, are you saying there is no point in being a genius? Just another pointless label?

Oh no - not just another pointless label. The most pointless label!

Dude - Take a chill pill.

It would just get mixed up with all the other medications I am on. Right, Diebert...?

firefly, are you familiar with Otto Weininger...? It is possible, of course, to be misunderstood. Even "grandly" so. Specifically what would your equivalent of a "chill pill" be? What relaxes you, what would give you the hope your first post indicated you were missing?

[Firefly]

It's relatively simple. You have to figure it out and tell me the pattern. :: is analogue. Work that intellect like a 50c call girl, ride the camel to the grave :D

An encryption based on my first post then, kinda figured that at first.

"52men" guessing your not lonely.. line five word two and has something to do with men? 'to' + 'men' = join? Welcome? Guessing the period declared the end of context. "58idu" ..line five word eight and has something to do with share or the stock market? (idu is down btw) Fond? Warrior? Home/castle? Mixed with "what" + tit and "being" + al

Welcome home wandering friend? A wild guess.

"and" + eti, "aspect-I" + erb + "so-... yah didn't work here..

Where does the inner lie? The camel you offer isn't my kind of motivation.

[Firefly]

No, you said you dropped out - after giving less than a year.

The reason why I asked what school it was is because it does matter. I am aware that uni life has a profoundly elusive quality to it, like Purgatory. Here are all these people supposedly preparing you for life - but then what kind of life? One like theirs, rampant with inane politics and under-achievement and resentment that they never could make it out there? So do you believe them? You don't want to be like them, you soon realize, but you are paying all this money, and a college degree is the single greatest deciding factor in socio-economic welfare and success.

I dropped out to counter my lack of will. I missed to many classes unintentionally because I didn't care enough to keep the days strait and didn't notice my lethargy or its cause until it was too late. To save face with financial aid I dropped the classes. Will try again next fall and I'm looking for vigor renewal to aid my success.

Also, I have said here many times I am no genius, so here is why I didn't pick up on your age. If you are soooo bright, you personal sojourn of inquiry could have begun at an early age, so that its 17-year span would drop you in your twenties. That would make your average professor older than you. And algebra was my strong suit!

Never said I was bright, just that I fit the bill and that bill isn't really mine. I began when I was 4, I didn't decide on it as a mission of focus till I was 18. I saw that I could figure it out and took a few weeks thinking about it before accepting it as the best course for my life. I knew I would be alone, I knew I would have moments like this. I didn't know far it would take me, nor if I would make it back. For me it was if I was a lone pioneer. The more I learned the more I was removed from society.

I joined various groups over the years and studied their ways and wisdom and read about many more. The most enlightening group was the Objectivistic 'Randians'. Fell head first and read every scrap material I could find. It was the closest yet I could find yet I eventually fell out and they are constantly falling apart. Even wrote to the head of ARI and was shut out without a reason why. The land of false assumptions exiled the one who saw too much I guess.

There is no place for my kind in today's society. We can force our way in but it is by force. One big headache.

Having said that, if you give it time, you just may find that one teacher who turns on the light inside you where currently is darkness. And you clearly harbor darkness.

That teacher could be anyone and I do harbor darkness, I call it light, shadow of the night. It is all I have that keeps me on task, to find that light.

I love nature, I study every aspect of it and I have such ideas of grand import..

I'm sure you do. If so, you probably won't find the grass so green here.

Is why I push buttons. Head first is my favorite way.

By this last, are you saying there is no point in being a genius? Just another pointless label?

Oh no - not just another pointless label. The most pointless label!

Is my point, why use it unless you give it one? I give it; The unshakable seeker of truth. Roughly..

Dude - Take a chill pill.

It would just get mixed up with all the other medications I am on. Right, Diebert...?

Hehe..

firefly, are you familiar with Otto Weininger...? It is possible, of course, to be misunderstood. Even "grandly" so. Specifically what would your equivalent of a "chill pill" be? What relaxes you, what would give you the hope your first post indicated you were missing?

A path in the woods with the wind through the pines, ground under my feet, and the horizon at twilight with the sun resting on my goals to keep them warm. At the moment I have no path, not for this, and no sun. Only the pain of the dry pine needles sticking in my feet and the silence of death looming in the dark. The only light on the horizon is of the moon and its illusion of being the source of light. But it hovers over a spark. If I cannot find a path, I will have to make it.

So I am here.

[Cathy Preston]

The individuality is already a system by nature. An Idea machine based on relative truths. Society is the system by/for that system. He's talking about finding and implementing a cleaner social system. Another patch if nothing else. Very noble.

Society is a system serving the interests of community over individuality, and as such encourages conformity. Self can only be explored as an individual, not as a collective because as you pointed out any ideas of self are based on relative truths. if you want to promote society, or make a better system, then by all means go ahead but don't pretend you have the individual in mind when you do it.

[Gurrb]

To simply rebel against whatever society accepts is to remain in the mind-control of society. And it is easy to accept or deny a system, but the real, difficult challenge is to change the system itself, and to create a system that is firm but flexible, solid but adaptive, accepting but challenging. So here I am, a 20 years old who wrestles with his society to get to the very top, and will later use his power to turn it upside down. In the knowledge of its necessity, I stay with the educational system to change the very foundation of it.

Liberty.

it's difficult to overlook the contradictions in this, especially in its final statement. it sounds like a political speech.

you speak as though you want a unified, embracing society, yet your post has a strong 'me against the world' undertone to it. surely i am fitting the forum member bill to a tee, but i think you have to get off your high horse to see that it's still taking a shit out its backside.

and what does it matter to you if you are at the bottom of the job-ladder (or latter, as firefly calls it)? society or things that are already relatively crystallized cannot be changed so easily--people resent change (see obama for an example).

what school has unintentionally taught me is that we must focus on ourselves; we must create our own goals that are intrisically-motivated and derive happiness based on the attainment of these goals. i can propose my ideal society, but i find it rather futile. i find it difficult to imagine trying to change the way a flock of sea gulls operate without becoming one myself (or imposing power which eliminates any illusion of freedom).

and firefly, you're already trying to appease others on this forum. it's quite indicative of what i said in my original post.

to speak of education, i find it displeasuring that it has become a near-necessity ('near' because finding a way to feel accomplished by other means than occupational success is quite possible, and should be encouraged). it's not my cup of tea. i know it's not. you can say i'm unmotivated, i'm immature, and full of youthful rebellion, but it all boils down to it's just something i don't enjoy and its rewards are things i don't see myself enjoying either.

as for cousinbasil, let's just say i firmly disagree with you.