The Mystic....

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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Kunga » Fri Mar 30, 2012 7:42 am

Dennis Mahar wrote:language as a cloud and one walks around with the head in the clouds.


Then why are you walking around with your head in the clouds ? Do you not use language to communicate ? Are you mute all day ?



Dennis Mahar wrote:because duality exists in language and because duality is a complete and utter catastrophe,


There is no duality.
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Dennis Mahar » Fri Mar 30, 2012 8:09 am

You missed the point.
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Kunga » Fri Mar 30, 2012 8:38 am

i know what you are trying to say Dennis, but you are being hypocritical by criticising language in trying to say it. I know when language is used, it forms conceptual images, that separate things into objects....but these separate objects [separated by the conceptual use of language, differenciating between objects], are really not separate, as they are empty of inherent existence. Yet, we must relate to others in a conventional manner, as we are not separate from conventions.

Knowing non-duality, one still sees dualistic . Chop wood, carry water.



Within the expanse of spontaneous presence is the ground of all that arises.
Empty in essence, continuous by nature,
it has never existed as anything whatsoever, yet arises as anything at all.

[Longchenpa]
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Dennis Mahar » Fri Mar 30, 2012 10:05 am

but you are being hypocritical by criticising language in trying to say it


I'm not criticising language.
I'm distinguishing language.

It's a distinction that 'gets' language.

language is always/already splitting subject/object.

something is being said about something.

The Tao can't be spoken outright,
and yet enlightenment in relation to Tao is spoken into existence through deduction.

At the bus stop.
People waiting.
Clocks tick.
Bus is languaged to be late.
people irritated, impatient, angry, 'dominated by a condition'.

When I say 'empty and meaningless'
I say 'bus is late' is empty due to causes.
I say the emotional/psychological reaction to 'bus is late' is meaningless.
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Kunga » Fri Mar 30, 2012 11:28 am

Too lazy to be ambitious,
I let the world take care of itself.
Ten days' worth of rice in my bag;
a bundle of twigs by the fireplace.
Why chatter about delusion and enlightenment?
Listening to the night rain on my roof,
I sit comfortably, with both legs stretched out.


[Ryokan]
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Dennis Mahar » Sat Mar 31, 2012 10:17 pm

Have you been,
for instance,
with a Japanese person who doesn't speak English,
and you don't speak Japanese.

and felt embarassment to be,

and fumbled to express some way,

as if to hide embarassment.

and kind of made it worse.

and then tried to fix that,

and kind of stuffed up again,

and then tried to fix that,

and then just made some friendly gesture and walked off.

So what is language about?
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Kunga » Sun Apr 01, 2012 3:31 am

“When you realize how perfect everything is you will tilt your head back and laugh at the sky."
- Buddha

"Excuse me....while I kiss the sky....."
-Jimi

"It's empty and meaningless"
-Denijuna
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Dennis Mahar » Sun Apr 01, 2012 8:15 am

How about 20 people crowded into an elevator?

Eyes practically forced to avert each other and looking down toward the feet and speaking is sort of a risky business.

What is it about language?

It seems there's nothing and then there's semantics.

What's happening when you say hello?

There's a sense of 'coming out of hiding' by languaging,

and then there's a sense of another kind of hiding available,

hiding in language.
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Kunga » Sun Apr 01, 2012 11:02 am

You are not communication well with me Dennis.
I really don't know what you are getting at.
Are you trying to say, that when we recognize another human being
and say "Hello", we are acually separating ourself instead of being in Absolute Reality ?

Try again.
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Kunga » Sun Apr 01, 2012 11:38 am

So...I'm in a elevator with myself.
Myself says "Hello" , to myself.
I reply "Hello" back to myself.
Then all of "us" get off the elevator.
Scatterring in different directions....like zombies.
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Kunga » Sun Apr 01, 2012 11:53 am

Here's the Absolute Reality of it :



Throughout the entire universe, all beings and all that manifests as form
are adornments of basic space, arising as the ongoing principle of enlightened form.
What is audible, all sounds and voices without exception, as many as there may be,
are adornments of basic space, arising as the ongoing principle of enlightened speech.
All consciousness and all stirring and proliferation of thoughts, as well
as the inconceivable range of nonconceptual states,
are adornments of basic space, arising as the ongoing principle of enlightened mind.

[Longchenpa]
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Kunga » Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:02 pm

All phenomena is of the One Mind.
All sound is of the One Mind.
Good, bad, ugly, beautiful...all is equally the same essence.

The Void.


Playing Now At A Theatre Near You !

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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Dennis Mahar » Sun Apr 01, 2012 1:38 pm

Getting a handle on language.
As a standing out from Being as projection.

Tell me who you are without language.

Tell me you are tall.
That can only be in relation to short.
It exists only in language as a consensual reality.
Hiding in tall as if it's an advantage is what it looks like.

People tend to cluster together for security in a concept 'Looking Good'.
In relation to what?
Trillions of dollars are spent on 'Looking Good'.
suffering.
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Kunga » Sun Apr 01, 2012 2:42 pm

Dennis Mahar wrote:Tell me who you are without language.


Ask me without language.
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Dennis Mahar » Sun Apr 01, 2012 3:57 pm

Well?

did you get it?
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Kunga » Sun Apr 01, 2012 4:05 pm

Who got what ?
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Dennis Mahar » Sun Apr 01, 2012 4:22 pm

You popped ol' smelly.
Keep the void void thanks.
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Kunga » Sun Apr 01, 2012 4:50 pm

"You" ?

Take a enema !
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Dennis Mahar » Mon Apr 02, 2012 5:35 am

somehow language took over.
you have to have an opinion.
your opinion is how you are known and able to be dealt with summarily.
some opinions work better.
not having an opinion is considered strange.

A raft of opinions to get by as a cover.

don't tell her she's got a big bum,
all hell breaks loose,
and don't you just love her new shoes.
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Kunga » Mon Apr 02, 2012 6:47 am

Intension is everything.

_/\_
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Dennis Mahar » Mon Apr 02, 2012 11:07 am

Intension is everything.


What are you up to?
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Kunga » Mon Apr 02, 2012 1:02 pm

Dennis Mahar wrote:
Intension is everything.


What are you up to?


Same thing you are.
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Dennis Mahar » Mon Apr 02, 2012 1:48 pm

off with the pixies?
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Kunga » Tue Apr 03, 2012 12:46 am

Am I annoying you ?
Yes you are.
Ok...sorry.

_/\_
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Re: The Mystic....

Postby Dennis Mahar » Tue Apr 03, 2012 7:35 am

Isn't language difficult?
always second guessing,
are two ever on the same page?

There's something about someone's language that isn't the contents.
Language as deployment.
A Being sends it's language out there not to reveal itself necessarily except a revelation is present in the carrier wave of it.

A message in a bottle.

The message is the contents and the bottle is the context, as a metaphor.

Context is decisive.

Contexts are 'grokked' such as:

'acting the goat'
'life of the party'
'biggest dick in a pissing contest'
'look how clever I am'
'I get the last word'
'the bride wears white' (high moral ground)
'being a pro'

none of that kind of context is transformative because in that nobody is listening.

capiche?
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