Marriage and Cuckolding (cont'd from "pop tarts")
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MKFaizi
I certainly agree that there is no mystery to women. They act the way they act and do the things they do that are peculiar to their gender. It's not a big deal.
I also think that beautiful or attractive women are considered to be mysterious. Ugly women are not mysterious at all.
Another part of the mystery is giving birth. I had two kids and I see nothing mysterious about it. You get knocked up. Nine months gestation and the baby comes out. Not even very painful, unless there are difficulties. Just not that big a deal. Cows do it every day.
Faizi
I also think that beautiful or attractive women are considered to be mysterious. Ugly women are not mysterious at all.
Another part of the mystery is giving birth. I had two kids and I see nothing mysterious about it. You get knocked up. Nine months gestation and the baby comes out. Not even very painful, unless there are difficulties. Just not that big a deal. Cows do it every day.
Faizi
- Leyla Shen
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Well, I'm not sure. I'm having trouble working out our roles: which one of us is the woman?sevens wrote:Leyla,
Let's cut all this womanly bullshit.
Do you want to talk?
Of course, as you know, I don't mind talking. What I find somewhat difficult to do, however, is talking in circles.
I just don't see the point of it.
- Leyla Shen
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- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:12 pm
- Location: Flippen-well AUSTRALIA
Scott wrote:
You do something dangerous, you’re likely to get thrown in jail. What happens to being a good provider then?
I have! But what does that tell you? So much value on sex it’s unbelievable. It just really isn’t worth that much.Read the Brad/Elizabeth thing in this forum. Do you think Brad wasn't hurt? He didn't really show signs of sadness, but it wasn't like he felt great about the whole thing.
I agree, it probably isn’t a good thing. More like an emotional self-defense mechanism, no?I'll have you know though, it doesn't hurt for me anymore. When a girl does something crazy like fucks someone behind my back now, I just kind of laugh...which is probably not a good thing! (yes it has recently happened, sort of)
I know that’s what you’re saying. Society is not structured that way, though, is it? So, one would assume that the sexes evolve according to the environment, no? I mean, you still have your guys who religiously go to the gym and pump iron. But where’s the danger? The excitement? How about rock-climbing? Do these things pay?Leyla: In the really ol' days, the exciting, risk-taking, muscular type was the good provider.
Scott: That's what I'm saying! Why can't guys meld the two personality types back together? I personally just think they need some help.
You do something dangerous, you’re likely to get thrown in jail. What happens to being a good provider then?
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MKFaizi
Well, yes, in a sketchy way. Like the same sort of sketchiness is true of women.Heh, that's very true about men.
The problem really is not the separate genders. The problem is the relationship between the genders -- marriage and other living arrangements.
Except for the problem of sexual desire, the genders would be separate.
With no sexual desire -- gender to gender or same gender -- no need for relationships of a sexual nature -- a lot of human strife would be nullified.
Woman is only as repulisve as Man. As evident in this thread, even the resident two sages are still filled with delusions about the allure of Woman. Still entranced by the creatures.
I like the male form. I find it attractive. Just not attractive enough. Adonis on the Half Shell -- however you might envision him -- Johnny Depp, Kenye West, Tupac, Fifty, Brad Pitt, Axel Rose -- it's just a load of make-up; hype. Bullshit hype -- just like Playboy air-brush dreams.
The very idea that woman could be pure in any way is delusional. The very notion of purity is delusional.
How archaic. Women don't pretend to that bullshit no more. Not young women anyway. That notion is strictly Marilyn Monroe.
If you have a teenage son, you know this.
Faizi
Leyla,
I have! But what does that tell you? So much value on sex it’s unbelievable. It just really isn’t worth that much.
Men should probably stop equating relationships with sex, then.
I agree, it probably isn’t a good thing. More like an emotional self-defense mechanism, no?
I bet it is. It doesn't bother me, though. I'm enjoying my life.
I know that’s what you’re saying. Society is not structured that way, though, is it? So, one would assume that the sexes evolve according to the environment, no? I mean, you still have your guys who religiously go to the gym and pump iron. But where’s the danger? The excitement? How about rock-climbing? Do these things pay?
You do something dangerous, you’re likely to get thrown in jail. What happens to being a good provider then?
What about guys on SWAT teams, or spies for the CIA? There are still people out there that embody the dangerous personality type that aren't "bad" people. As long as they aren't stiffs, even cops could pull it off.
Hell, even being associated with the military does it for most women.
I read something on the sarcastic publication...I think it's called society for truth? I'm a little drunk and tired right now, so I can't recall...but it was talking about how to get a woman to marry you from some psychologist's perspective. One of the ideas was to be violent towards everything in the world, and apparently that would make the woman like you. I thought, "wow, how funny and true". I've known many guys where this was the case.
The more "manly" the man, the more attracted the woman got. Maybe if a boring guy completely took on all manly characteristics and only showed that, he'd be attractive? There's got to be quite a few personality types which could match up with the "dangerous" type, besides military/swat/cia spy guys. Maybe just a local ass beater. A guy could take karate lessons or something....or pretend to be a criminal by just watching action movies and acting like one with his friends.
"I'll meet you at the pier around 9. Don't show up with any cops." He clicks the cell phone off............wouldn't that work? Disguise the lies with mystery, like "I don't want you to show up with me, it'll look suspicious."
Except for the problem of sexual desire, the genders would be separate.
I'm not sure about this. There's been a few times where I just wanted a female companion near me. Just the "energy" of one, to kind of balance me out.
I have! But what does that tell you? So much value on sex it’s unbelievable. It just really isn’t worth that much.
Men should probably stop equating relationships with sex, then.
I agree, it probably isn’t a good thing. More like an emotional self-defense mechanism, no?
I bet it is. It doesn't bother me, though. I'm enjoying my life.
I know that’s what you’re saying. Society is not structured that way, though, is it? So, one would assume that the sexes evolve according to the environment, no? I mean, you still have your guys who religiously go to the gym and pump iron. But where’s the danger? The excitement? How about rock-climbing? Do these things pay?
You do something dangerous, you’re likely to get thrown in jail. What happens to being a good provider then?
What about guys on SWAT teams, or spies for the CIA? There are still people out there that embody the dangerous personality type that aren't "bad" people. As long as they aren't stiffs, even cops could pull it off.
Hell, even being associated with the military does it for most women.
I read something on the sarcastic publication...I think it's called society for truth? I'm a little drunk and tired right now, so I can't recall...but it was talking about how to get a woman to marry you from some psychologist's perspective. One of the ideas was to be violent towards everything in the world, and apparently that would make the woman like you. I thought, "wow, how funny and true". I've known many guys where this was the case.
The more "manly" the man, the more attracted the woman got. Maybe if a boring guy completely took on all manly characteristics and only showed that, he'd be attractive? There's got to be quite a few personality types which could match up with the "dangerous" type, besides military/swat/cia spy guys. Maybe just a local ass beater. A guy could take karate lessons or something....or pretend to be a criminal by just watching action movies and acting like one with his friends.
"I'll meet you at the pier around 9. Don't show up with any cops." He clicks the cell phone off............wouldn't that work? Disguise the lies with mystery, like "I don't want you to show up with me, it'll look suspicious."
Except for the problem of sexual desire, the genders would be separate.
I'm not sure about this. There's been a few times where I just wanted a female companion near me. Just the "energy" of one, to kind of balance me out.
- Leyla Shen
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- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:12 pm
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DQ: A woman with a boyfriend/husband feels that she is the most virtuous of all women and dwells at the opposite end of the spectrum from "worthless slut". She thus feels she has plenty of leeway to indulge her sexual lusts without having her social status slip too far.
L: That is certainly not the way it was for me.
Being married was probably the most degrading experience of my life. It lasted one year. But then, I've always been vehemently opposed to notions of "social status."
DQ: Why was that?
I spent my entire childhood observing this brand of “virtuous women†and their men. Frankly, if that’s what virtuous is, I’d rather be a worthless slut.
Fucking hilarious, really. The sheer desperation to marry a young woman off at any “good†price to get you off their hands. Oh, and the bountiful rewards! And all I had to do was spread my legs for the one man for the rest of my life. There was, apparently, some consolation. After a non-specified amount of time, you could let him get his rocks off elsewhere and not give at all. Though, we never speak about these things much, really. They‘re men, after all. We prefer to bitch about other women. And, God, if ever the woman went off to have sex with someone else -- well, hell hath no fury like Woman scorned.
The Woman of the West is a little different, though. I mean, she gets to look like a whore -- behave like one, even -- and still be pure and mysterious.
In my attempt to come to some sort of a beneficial compromise between my integrity and Woman‘s demands, I kinda became a mixture of two versions of Woman. I met a guy and figured we could go the total honesty route -- you know, both being adults. Gave him everything straight down the line and asked for the same in return. And there I found myself again (after the fact of marriage) being told what I should think, because I couldn’t think, which made me vulnerable to all sorts of monsters and their machinations, you see.
So, we signed a marriage certificate and I became his, right down to the surname. The biggest Cinderella wedding (500 guests, two fabulous bands on rotating shifts), one year of blissful monotony, a fabulous house with the latest mod cons and a huge fireplace, my favourite classical sports car (260Z), the perfect husband…
In hindsight, I guess I should have been grateful because, despite the fact that I was hollow, stupid and monstrous, he loved me and he would have looked after me my whole life.
But then, what can you expect from a woman?
- Leyla Shen
- Posts: 3851
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:12 pm
- Location: Flippen-well AUSTRALIA
Scott,
If you did that, what exactly would you look for in a woman, Scott?
I think I have told at least part of this story before, but I find it applicable here. I had a criminal boyfriend. Very exciting. Did more for me and the kids than pussy-arsed fucking control-freak cops ever could. You see, cops have a way of making the law work for them. They will stand there and tell you that until someone has been hurt, they cannot act on rights. So, someone fuck’s with you because you are a single woman and they have husbands -- total fucking harassment -- and until you get it on (and lose as the single woman, obviously) you get done for it because you threw the first punch. Of course, you try to get around this by introducing the cops in the first place -- only to find (you guessed it) that these people have the right to stand out in front of your house 24/7 harassing you and your kids because the road is public property.
Naturally, once you do act, as long as you can cover your arse, all is well and good -- even if you lie.
Nah, any thing close to a thinking woman wouldn’t go for a cop. Or a pretend crim.
Men should probably stop equating relationships with sex, then.
If you did that, what exactly would you look for in a woman, Scott?
You want the “energy†of a female that would fall for this? You sure you’re not still talking about sex?Scott: The more "manly" the man, the more attracted the woman got. Maybe if a boring guy completely took on all manly characteristics and only showed that, he'd be attractive? There's got to be quite a few personality types which could match up with the "dangerous" type, besides military/swat/cia spy guys. Maybe just a local ass beater. A guy could take karate lessons or something....or pretend to be a criminal by just watching action movies and acting like one with his friends.
"I'll meet you at the pier around 9. Don't show up with any cops." He clicks the cell phone off............wouldn't that work? Disguise the lies with mystery, like "I don't want you to show up with me, it'll look suspicious."
Marsha: Except for the problem of sexual desire, the genders would be separate.
Scott: I'm not sure about this. There's been a few times where I just wanted a female companion near me. Just the "energy" of one, to kind of balance me out.
I think I have told at least part of this story before, but I find it applicable here. I had a criminal boyfriend. Very exciting. Did more for me and the kids than pussy-arsed fucking control-freak cops ever could. You see, cops have a way of making the law work for them. They will stand there and tell you that until someone has been hurt, they cannot act on rights. So, someone fuck’s with you because you are a single woman and they have husbands -- total fucking harassment -- and until you get it on (and lose as the single woman, obviously) you get done for it because you threw the first punch. Of course, you try to get around this by introducing the cops in the first place -- only to find (you guessed it) that these people have the right to stand out in front of your house 24/7 harassing you and your kids because the road is public property.
Naturally, once you do act, as long as you can cover your arse, all is well and good -- even if you lie.
Nah, any thing close to a thinking woman wouldn’t go for a cop. Or a pretend crim.
If you did that, what exactly would you look for in a woman, Scott?
It's like my close guy friends. People I get along with...who I don't get sick of and who I have fun with.
You want the “energy†of a female that would fall for this? You sure you’re not still talking about sex?
I was talking about attracting a woman. Attracting and having a relationship are definitely different things, since attracting a woman involves doing something other than you naturally do. Having a relationship should involve being yourself...and not ____ing. Any word with an "ing" at the end means it's a fluctuation of "you". You know?
Nah, any thing close to a thinking woman wouldn’t go for a cop. Or a pretend crim.
I see your point.
It's like my close guy friends. People I get along with...who I don't get sick of and who I have fun with.
You want the “energy†of a female that would fall for this? You sure you’re not still talking about sex?
I was talking about attracting a woman. Attracting and having a relationship are definitely different things, since attracting a woman involves doing something other than you naturally do. Having a relationship should involve being yourself...and not ____ing. Any word with an "ing" at the end means it's a fluctuation of "you". You know?
Nah, any thing close to a thinking woman wouldn’t go for a cop. Or a pretend crim.
I see your point.
- David Quinn
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Leyla wrote:
When you say that you have always been vehemently opposed to notions of social status, why did you allow yourself to be married to that particular kind of man and partake in a big social wedding?
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So it wasn't marriage itself, as a concept, that you found degrading, it was the type of marriage you had?L: Being married was probably the most degrading experience of my life. It lasted one year. But then, I've always been vehemently opposed to notions of "social status."
DQ: Why was that?
L: I met a guy and figured we could go the total honesty route -- you know, both being adults. Gave him everything straight down the line and asked for the same in return. And there I found myself again (after the fact of marriage) being told what I should think, because I couldn’t think, which made me vulnerable to all sorts of monsters and their machinations, you see.
So, we signed a marriage certificate and I became his, right down to the surname. The biggest Cinderella wedding (500 guests, two fabulous bands on rotating shifts), one year of blissful monotony, a fabulous house with the latest mod cons and a huge fireplace, my favourite classical sports car (260Z), the perfect husband…
In hindsight, I guess I should have been grateful because, despite the fact that I was hollow, stupid and monstrous, he loved me and he would have looked after me my whole life.
But then, what can you expect from a woman?
When you say that you have always been vehemently opposed to notions of social status, why did you allow yourself to be married to that particular kind of man and partake in a big social wedding?
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- Leyla Shen
- Posts: 3851
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:12 pm
- Location: Flippen-well AUSTRALIA
Well, yes and no. At the time, I had figured that there might be a slight possibility that a relationship could be made to work, between two rational individuals, despite the bullshit of ceremony. (Ironic, eh?)So it wasn't marriage itself, as a concept, that you found degrading, it was the type of marriage you had?
A marriage, after all, is a legal agreement. He came out of it with almost every cent he put in, without lawyers. I think, after all was said and done, I ended up a few thousand dollars better off -- pretty cheap considering what you would have to pay for the services of a professional prostitute for a year.
That particular kind of man: he knew the deal and had accepted it. All the history right up to the very reason for the wedding itself. The good thing about a Turkish wedding is the closest relatives end up paying for it. Had a suitcase full of money by the end of the evening. Just handed it right over.When you say that you have always been vehemently opposed to notions of social status, why did you allow yourself to be married to that particular kind of man and partake in a big social wedding?
We were both kidding ourselves. What I wasn't sure of was, which one of us was more the idiot.
The social wedding: to appease my mother. I felt guilty for not being what I should be. And for not marrying a Turk. The least I could do was to allow her a typical Turkish wedding.
It was a really bad day for me! Not to mention Richard -- who made it through being his usual passive, "understanding" self.
But, mum? Well, she was in her element, I reckon.
- Leyla Shen
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- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:12 pm
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Why don't you just stick with your close friends, then? Course, being heterosexual, sex would be out of the question. :)Scott: If you did that, what exactly would you look for in a woman, Scott?
It's like my close guy friends. People I get along with...who I don't get sick of and who I have fun with.
Well, attraction leads to a relationship -- even between you and your male friends. The question is, what is it you are trying to attract and why?Leyla: You want the “energy†of a female that would fall for this? You sure you’re not still talking about sex?
Scott: I was talking about attracting a woman. Attracting and having a relationship are definitely different things, since attracting a woman involves doing something other than you naturally do. Having a relationship should involve being yourself...and not ____ing. Any word with an "ing" at the end means it's a fluctuation of "you". You know?
Relationships can last from anything between .01 (for example) of a millisecond to the entire span of a lifetime.
- David Quinn
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Why don't you just stick with your close friends, then? Course, being heterosexual, sex would be out of the question. :)
That's pretty much what I do.
Don't think I'm saying I don't want to have a relationship, and that I don't want to have a bunch of hot sex. I'm not deluded. I'm just telling you that they aren't the same thing. There IS such a thing in this world as a good relationship!
Well, attraction leads to a relationship -- even between you and your male friends. The question is, what is it you are trying to attract and why?
If it's for sex, some girl who'll be sexy for me for a while. If it's for a relationship, someone with values and a similar viewpoint as mine (not easy to come by).
Actually it's impossible to come by, so I pretty much just hang out with guy friends and then get sluts who mean nothing to me.
That's pretty much what I do.
Don't think I'm saying I don't want to have a relationship, and that I don't want to have a bunch of hot sex. I'm not deluded. I'm just telling you that they aren't the same thing. There IS such a thing in this world as a good relationship!
Well, attraction leads to a relationship -- even between you and your male friends. The question is, what is it you are trying to attract and why?
If it's for sex, some girl who'll be sexy for me for a while. If it's for a relationship, someone with values and a similar viewpoint as mine (not easy to come by).
Actually it's impossible to come by, so I pretty much just hang out with guy friends and then get sluts who mean nothing to me.
- Leyla Shen
- Posts: 3851
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:12 pm
- Location: Flippen-well AUSTRALIA
- Leyla Shen
- Posts: 3851
- Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:12 pm
- Location: Flippen-well AUSTRALIA

