Since you can understand no logical justification for the desire to reproduce; then don't. We will feed on your carcass. Amen!prince wrote:If you can concieve of now and eternity as one and the same, you would understand why there is no logical justification for the desire to reproduce, (other instances of human beings).propellerbeanie wrote:It is because as human beings we can only concieve of now that we can concieve of eternity.
astral projection
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propellerbeanie
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MKFaizi
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propellerbeanie
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That is what is wrong with having the great big mighty brain we are born with, and having a culture that makes a fetish of the antinatural. Reproduction is a natural activity, like, in some respects, eating or dumping. You don't hear many Dexters asking: Why do I eat, or why do I dump? But of reproduction they ask for justification. Why? Because it takes energy and wealth to raise children? Why? Because the pleasure involved is nothing in comparison to the pain, or pain possible in raising children?MKFaizi wrote:Bean wrote:
What is a logical justification for the desire to reproduce? A hard dick?logical justification for the desire to reproduce
Faizi
There is only one credible reason for reproduction, and that is love. If you love life you share it, and give it. Love produces children, and children born without love are not children at all; but young monsters. When people ask why reproduce; they are admitting they have nothing to give, and no love to share. When they refuse to reproduce they are throwing futility in the face of their parent's desires to find value in life, and to cheat death, and to become immortal. A person without children is a perpetual child choosing a toyed ego over a complete existence.
Last edited by propellerbeanie on Mon Mar 13, 2006 3:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
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propellerbeanie
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- Leyla Shen
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- Location: Flippen-well AUSTRALIA
When people ask why reproduce; they are admitting they have nothing to give, and no love to share. When they refuse to reproduce they are throwing futility in the face of their parent's desires to find value in life, and to cheat death, and to become immortal. A person without children is a perpetual child choosing a toyed ego over a complete
You are being very narrow-minded.
If I could honestly look around me and say that every couple that has had children is not living their own "missed childhood" through them, I might support your position.
You had children to make your parents happy and forego immortality?
I am finding some cool ideas by propellerbeanie.
That is what is wrong with having the great big mighty brain we are born with, and having a culture that makes a fetish of the antinatural.
It may possibly be natural for our culture to have a fetish for the antinatural. Remember, everything that happens IS nature...happening. It may not be in your best interests, or the human race's best interests. So then you change that course of events to a new one, which is also natural.
Reproduction is a natural activity, like, in some respects, eating or dumping. You don't hear many Dexters asking: Why do I eat, or why do I dump? But of reproduction they ask for justification. Why? Because it takes energy and wealth to raise children? Why? Because the pleasure involved is nothing in comparison to the pain, or pain possible in raising children?
This is good stuff. If you become turned on, and deny it, that's your choice. But if you accept it and do what you desire, that's also your choice. The outcomes aren't as dire as if you choose to not eat or not dump...both of those will cause you a lot of misery. If you choose to not have sex, the "consequences" are pretty good. You don't experience the suffering of becoming addicted to sex, getting STDs, having a girl become attached to you and you having to break her heart, having to hide it from your parents (if they're against it in any way)...the list could go on. On the flipside, if you don't have children when your parents want you to, then you have to deal with them feeling bad that you aren't continuing on, making them grandparents. Then you have to deal the rest of your life with that weight on your shoulders. It's a tricky subject, along the lines of the recent post about "either/or".
There is only one credible reason for reproduction, and that is love.
I always get confused when people justify reproduction in this manner. What does love have to do with fucking, or raising a child? If you love your woman, does this automatically mean that you should impregnate her? I don't personally see how it does. What if she doesn't want to have your child? Or have a belly at least twice as big. Would impregnating her be a loving thing? What if she wants one really bad but you don't? Is it loving for her to impose her will on you, putting you in financial debt, and taking up your nights with a child's cries? Is it loving to bring a child into this world full of sadness, anger, hatred, addiction and abuse? These are personal questions, which don't have universal answers.
If you love life you share it, and give it.
If you love life and others don't, yet you share it, you aren't loving those people.
Love produces children, and children born without love are not children at all; but young monsters.
This may be the case sometimes, because of the absence of a father or mother. Or maybe the environment the child is growing up in makes them a monster. I don't think all bastards are monsters though. To make a monster, everything in the world has to be aligned just right so they become one. You could say the stars have to be just right (or wrong!). A child could grow up a bastard, in a bad home, with no loving influence, and still turn out to be a great human being. A lot of the time that actually happens. In fact, I've met more of these than monsters.
When people ask why reproduce; they are admitting they have nothing to give, and no love to share.
No, they're just asking "why reproduce?" I see where you're coming from though, I guess.
When they refuse to reproduce they are throwing futility in the face of their parent's desires to find value in life, and to cheat death, and to become immortal. A person without children is a perpetual child choosing a toyed ego over a complete existence.
A complete existence is having a child? Are you a mom, or just a male with feminine tendencies? Do you think your ego disappears when you have a child? Because it doesn't. If you're seeking immortality through spreading your seed, then forget it. It doesn't make you any more immortal than if you burnt your body and threw it in the Ganges, or if you spit and bled on the ground.
Marsha asked,
What is a logical justification for the desire to reproduce? A hard dick?
Yes. What's so illogical about a hard dick? It's as base as an enlightened brain.
That is what is wrong with having the great big mighty brain we are born with, and having a culture that makes a fetish of the antinatural.
It may possibly be natural for our culture to have a fetish for the antinatural. Remember, everything that happens IS nature...happening. It may not be in your best interests, or the human race's best interests. So then you change that course of events to a new one, which is also natural.
Reproduction is a natural activity, like, in some respects, eating or dumping. You don't hear many Dexters asking: Why do I eat, or why do I dump? But of reproduction they ask for justification. Why? Because it takes energy and wealth to raise children? Why? Because the pleasure involved is nothing in comparison to the pain, or pain possible in raising children?
This is good stuff. If you become turned on, and deny it, that's your choice. But if you accept it and do what you desire, that's also your choice. The outcomes aren't as dire as if you choose to not eat or not dump...both of those will cause you a lot of misery. If you choose to not have sex, the "consequences" are pretty good. You don't experience the suffering of becoming addicted to sex, getting STDs, having a girl become attached to you and you having to break her heart, having to hide it from your parents (if they're against it in any way)...the list could go on. On the flipside, if you don't have children when your parents want you to, then you have to deal with them feeling bad that you aren't continuing on, making them grandparents. Then you have to deal the rest of your life with that weight on your shoulders. It's a tricky subject, along the lines of the recent post about "either/or".
There is only one credible reason for reproduction, and that is love.
I always get confused when people justify reproduction in this manner. What does love have to do with fucking, or raising a child? If you love your woman, does this automatically mean that you should impregnate her? I don't personally see how it does. What if she doesn't want to have your child? Or have a belly at least twice as big. Would impregnating her be a loving thing? What if she wants one really bad but you don't? Is it loving for her to impose her will on you, putting you in financial debt, and taking up your nights with a child's cries? Is it loving to bring a child into this world full of sadness, anger, hatred, addiction and abuse? These are personal questions, which don't have universal answers.
If you love life you share it, and give it.
If you love life and others don't, yet you share it, you aren't loving those people.
Love produces children, and children born without love are not children at all; but young monsters.
This may be the case sometimes, because of the absence of a father or mother. Or maybe the environment the child is growing up in makes them a monster. I don't think all bastards are monsters though. To make a monster, everything in the world has to be aligned just right so they become one. You could say the stars have to be just right (or wrong!). A child could grow up a bastard, in a bad home, with no loving influence, and still turn out to be a great human being. A lot of the time that actually happens. In fact, I've met more of these than monsters.
When people ask why reproduce; they are admitting they have nothing to give, and no love to share.
No, they're just asking "why reproduce?" I see where you're coming from though, I guess.
When they refuse to reproduce they are throwing futility in the face of their parent's desires to find value in life, and to cheat death, and to become immortal. A person without children is a perpetual child choosing a toyed ego over a complete existence.
A complete existence is having a child? Are you a mom, or just a male with feminine tendencies? Do you think your ego disappears when you have a child? Because it doesn't. If you're seeking immortality through spreading your seed, then forget it. It doesn't make you any more immortal than if you burnt your body and threw it in the Ganges, or if you spit and bled on the ground.
Marsha asked,
What is a logical justification for the desire to reproduce? A hard dick?
Yes. What's so illogical about a hard dick? It's as base as an enlightened brain.
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propellerbeanie
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- Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2006 5:06 am
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propellerbeanie
- Posts: 154
- Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2006 5:06 am
You get more of an ego having children, and you get more than an ego having children. Think of it this way: If you were the last person on earth you would lose your self with your last companion. Our self is what we get through seeing ourselves in relationships, with others, but different.sschaula wrote:I am finding some cool ideas by propellerbeanie.
All culture is anti natural, especially where people must live very naturally. So while you can say this is a natural activity, the end of the activity is a line between man and nature. Even the most primitive of peoples are scientists.That is what is wrong with having the great big mighty brain we are born with, and having a culture that makes a fetish of the antinatural.
It may possibly be natural for our culture to have a fetish for the antinatural. Remember, everything that happens IS nature...happening. It may not be in your best interests, or the human race's best interests. So then you change that course of events to a new one, which is also natural.
Fcking is a violent word, and sometimes sexuality is a mask for violence of all sorts. Raising a child has everything to do with love, and only a human animal is ever raised without love. But everyone has got to work it out for themselves. Love is hope, and no matter how rotton the world seems, where there is love there is hope, and where there is love there is life.There is only one credible reason for reproduction, and that is love.
I always get confused when people justify reproduction in this manner. What does love have to do with fucking, or raising a child? If you love your woman, does this automatically mean that you should impregnate her? I don't personally see how it does. What if she doesn't want to have your child? Or have a belly at least twice as big. Would impregnating her be a loving thing? What if she wants one really bad but you don't? Is it loving for her to impose her will on you, putting you in financial debt, and taking up your nights with a child's cries? Is it loving to bring a child into this world full of sadness, anger, hatred, addiction and abuse? These are personal questions, which don't have universal answers.
Those without life cannot love life.If you love life you share it, and give it.
If you love life and others don't, yet you share it, you aren't loving those people.
I will admit that there are genetic reasons for monster, but far more social reasons. Love and not love are the day and night of everyones life, children included.Love produces children, and children born without love are not children at all; but young monsters.
This may be the case sometimes, because of the absence of a father or mother. Or maybe the environment the child is growing up in makes them a monster. I don't think all bastards are monsters though. To make a monster, everything in the world has to be aligned just right so they become one. You could say the stars have to be just right (or wrong!). A child could grow up a bastard, in a bad home, with no loving influence, and still turn out to be a great human being. A lot of the time that actually happens. In fact, I've met more of these than monsters.
When they refuse to reproduce they are throwing futility in the face of their parent's desires to find value in life, and to cheat death, and to become immortal. A person without children is a perpetual child choosing a toyed ego over a complete existence.
A complete existence is having a child? Are you a mom, or just a male with feminine tendencies? Do you think your ego disappears when you have a child? Because it doesn't. If you're seeking immortality through spreading your seed, then forget it. It doesn't make you any more immortal than if you burnt your body and threw it in the Ganges, or if you spit and bled on the ground.
And it is and is not just immortality. If I had a hundred children all half mine, not one of them would be me. Yet all would have in part from my willingness to share it some of my life. Life is a quality of everything because alive we can know everything, and few can give this life we know, but anyone can kill. killing is common, and even children are common because the intelligent- perhaps because of their amplified sensitivities cannot figure out how to do what average people can do in the dark.
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propellerbeanie
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It is not hard to share what I can't keep; like my life.Leyla Shen wrote:When people ask why reproduce; they are admitting they have nothing to give, and no love to share. When they refuse to reproduce they are throwing futility in the face of their parent's desires to find value in life, and to cheat death, and to become immortal. A person without children is a perpetual child choosing a toyed ego over a complete
You are being very narrow-minded.
Thank you. I only need it to keep my ears apart and I don't want to get stuck in the doorway.
So that wouldn't be love, right?If I could honestly look around me and say that every couple that has had children is not living their own "missed childhood" through them, I might support your position.
You had children to make your parents happy and forego immortality?
- David Quinn
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- Contact:
To me, propellerbeanie sounds more and more like a born-again Christian - except it is "love" and not Christ which he dogmatically worships.
"I used to be unhappy and an asshole towards women, but I have seen the light. Love is everything to me now." Like the born-again Christian, it is probable that he is overcompensating in his praise of love because of past sins.
In any case, the justifications he uses for this blind worshipping of love are incredibly weak. For example:
Anyone who loves life, and the brain they have been given, would naturally ask this question of everything. They would especially ask it of a phenomenon which is so pervasive in our society and has many consequences - namely, the meme for reproduction. It is all part of the process of getting to the root of things and understanding ultimate truth - which is the highest endeavour open to humankind.
Has your dogmatic worshiping of love reached such an extent that you are now admonishing people for having a questioning attitude towards things?
Or they may be admiting that they love truth.
There are many valid reasons for not wanting to reproduce - e.g. concerns about human overpopulation strangling the planet; not wanting to subject more children to the violent sadistic nature of modern society; wanting to have the time and freedom to promote wisdom in the world, etc. To accuse anyone who decides against having children of having "nothing to give" is disrespectful and absurd.
How did having sex and producing children make you become immortal?
Why do you spit on your True Mother (i.e. Nature) by burying your head in the sands of egotistical love and avoiding knowing her great secret?
I could just as easily say that a person without wisdom is a "perpetual child choosing a toyed ego over a complete existence". As always, your justifications come from an idealized vacuum and are meaningless.
Which is the greater being - Nature, or a person?
Which is the greater act - loving Nature, the Infinite, one's true Mother, or loving a handful of tiny ant-like creatures on a small insignificant planet?
Who is the more complete person - he who opens his entire being to the Infinite and lives freely without any lack, or he who attaches himself to a couple of people and hides away in them?
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"I used to be unhappy and an asshole towards women, but I have seen the light. Love is everything to me now." Like the born-again Christian, it is probable that he is overcompensating in his praise of love because of past sins.
In any case, the justifications he uses for this blind worshipping of love are incredibly weak. For example:
That is what is wrong with having the great big mighty brain we are born with, and having a culture that makes a fetish of the antinatural. Reproduction is a natural activity, like, in some respects, eating or dumping. You don't hear many Dexters asking: Why do I eat, or why do I dump? But of reproduction they ask for justification. Why?
Anyone who loves life, and the brain they have been given, would naturally ask this question of everything. They would especially ask it of a phenomenon which is so pervasive in our society and has many consequences - namely, the meme for reproduction. It is all part of the process of getting to the root of things and understanding ultimate truth - which is the highest endeavour open to humankind.
Has your dogmatic worshiping of love reached such an extent that you are now admonishing people for having a questioning attitude towards things?
There is only one credible reason for reproduction, and that is love. If you love life you share it, and give it. Love produces children, and children born without love are not children at all; but young monsters. When people ask why reproduce; they are admitting they have nothing to give, and no love to share.
Or they may be admiting that they love truth.
There are many valid reasons for not wanting to reproduce - e.g. concerns about human overpopulation strangling the planet; not wanting to subject more children to the violent sadistic nature of modern society; wanting to have the time and freedom to promote wisdom in the world, etc. To accuse anyone who decides against having children of having "nothing to give" is disrespectful and absurd.
When they refuse to reproduce they are throwing futility in the face of their parent's desires to find value in life, and to cheat death, and to become immortal.
How did having sex and producing children make you become immortal?
Why do you spit on your True Mother (i.e. Nature) by burying your head in the sands of egotistical love and avoiding knowing her great secret?
A person without children is a perpetual child choosing a toyed ego over a complete existence.
I could just as easily say that a person without wisdom is a "perpetual child choosing a toyed ego over a complete existence". As always, your justifications come from an idealized vacuum and are meaningless.
Which is the greater being - Nature, or a person?
Which is the greater act - loving Nature, the Infinite, one's true Mother, or loving a handful of tiny ant-like creatures on a small insignificant planet?
Who is the more complete person - he who opens his entire being to the Infinite and lives freely without any lack, or he who attaches himself to a couple of people and hides away in them?
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propellerbeanie
- Posts: 154
- Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2006 5:06 am
[
I do not worship love. I worship God as meme for all I do not understand and all that is greater than myself. Love is a virtue requiring strength and dispising weakness. From one angle love appears as hope, and from another angle it is wisdom.
Looking only at myself, I had every reason to believe in love and a stable relationship, even if that thought seemed boring to me when young. I did not marry to quit, but after that I hated women, but women found me attractive. So I counted, and when I lost track I started again. In my heart, and in my mind I kept an eye out for love, but I did not think I would find it. So, I ended up being something like a male slut. And worst of all; I actually thought I was doing some good. I thought that when a girl was down, or horney, or too drunk to drive or say no like she might have meant it -that I was helping her. I was helping myself to her. And I could have helped any of them better by leaving them be because I was not prepared to give them the one hundred percent of all the time and all my life that love demanded. And I tried to learn about women in case I found love I would be worthy, but that was a waste because in the end I found a woman is not women. I thought I would make a good husband, but I am reminded daily how bad I am at that. I don't expect people to wait. I don't expect people to not experiment. Too many women is a wet dream for a young man and a night terror for an old man. It is a constant reminder of my own stupidity and cruelty to think that once I was naked in the same room with these women, nominally for love, when that love has been made meaningless by true love. I do not care for these women even though I may have made a fine wife of any of them. The realization that I never really cared shows what I thought was love to be nothing more than the theft of intimacy. The wrong I did to these strangers is my punishment.
People are half ratio and half religio. Too much thought about a good thing never makes it better.
I do not love love, I love my wife who is my love. Why do you hate love?
Over population is worst where people have always felt the threat to their existence greatest. I have over reproduced myself, but some of my brothers and sisters have not. Perhaps they feel the violence and sadism of life as you do. If children are the cause of this they are also the cure. Clearly you feel you have nothing to give, or you would produce from your own soul fighters for wisdom and justice.
We have one being and different lives.
quote="DavidQuinn000"]To me, propellerbeanie sounds more and more like a born-again Christian - except it is "love" and not Christ which he dogmatically worships.
I do not worship love. I worship God as meme for all I do not understand and all that is greater than myself. Love is a virtue requiring strength and dispising weakness. From one angle love appears as hope, and from another angle it is wisdom.
It would take a book to explain my situation with women before I found love. Mostly it was hopeless, because if I had believed I would find my wife, and know this love I would not have done half of what I did. Part of what I did was out of hatred of women covered by a veneer of love of women. Now, you cannot love women. Women are a concept. It is like saying you love wisdom, or truth, or virtue. Concepts like these are mental fabrications of observed reality. A woman can be loved as an individual. To classify women as women is a sign of hatred. They can become as women an unattainable symbol of wealth and power, and even the small price of a magazine or movie can show them as servile sex slaves performing for money their most private passions. We heap contumely upon women, and frost that cake with the word: Love."I used to be unhappy and an asshole towards women, but I have seen the light. Love is everything to me now." Like the born-again Christian, it is probable that he is overcompensating in his praise of love because of past sins.
Looking only at myself, I had every reason to believe in love and a stable relationship, even if that thought seemed boring to me when young. I did not marry to quit, but after that I hated women, but women found me attractive. So I counted, and when I lost track I started again. In my heart, and in my mind I kept an eye out for love, but I did not think I would find it. So, I ended up being something like a male slut. And worst of all; I actually thought I was doing some good. I thought that when a girl was down, or horney, or too drunk to drive or say no like she might have meant it -that I was helping her. I was helping myself to her. And I could have helped any of them better by leaving them be because I was not prepared to give them the one hundred percent of all the time and all my life that love demanded. And I tried to learn about women in case I found love I would be worthy, but that was a waste because in the end I found a woman is not women. I thought I would make a good husband, but I am reminded daily how bad I am at that. I don't expect people to wait. I don't expect people to not experiment. Too many women is a wet dream for a young man and a night terror for an old man. It is a constant reminder of my own stupidity and cruelty to think that once I was naked in the same room with these women, nominally for love, when that love has been made meaningless by true love. I do not care for these women even though I may have made a fine wife of any of them. The realization that I never really cared shows what I thought was love to be nothing more than the theft of intimacy. The wrong I did to these strangers is my punishment.
That is what is wrong with having the great big mighty brain we are born with, and having a culture that makes a fetish of the antinatural. Reproduction is a natural activity, like, in some respects, eating or dumping. You don't hear many Dexters asking: Why do I eat, or why do I dump? But of reproduction they ask for justification. Why?
Anyone who loves life, and the brain they have been given, would naturally ask this question of everything. They would especially ask it of a phenomenon which is so pervasive in our society and has many consequences - namely, the meme for reproduction. It is all part of the process of getting to the root of things and understanding ultimate truth - which is the highest endeavour open to humankind.
People are half ratio and half religio. Too much thought about a good thing never makes it better.
Has your dogmatic worshiping of love reached such an extent that you are now admonishing people for having a questioning attitude towards things?
I do not love love, I love my wife who is my love. Why do you hate love?
As above, truth is a concept. We love people. We think concepts.There is only one credible reason for reproduction, and that is love. If you love life you share it, and give it. Love produces children, and children born without love are not children at all; but young monsters. When people ask why reproduce; they are admitting they have nothing to give, and no love to share.
Or they may be admiting that they love truth.
There are many valid reasons for not wanting to reproduce - e.g. concerns about human overpopulation strangling the planet; not wanting to subject more children to the violent sadistic nature of modern society; wanting to have the time and freedom to promote wisdom in the world, etc. To accuse anyone who decides against having children of having "nothing to give" is disrespectful and absurd.
Over population is worst where people have always felt the threat to their existence greatest. I have over reproduced myself, but some of my brothers and sisters have not. Perhaps they feel the violence and sadism of life as you do. If children are the cause of this they are also the cure. Clearly you feel you have nothing to give, or you would produce from your own soul fighters for wisdom and justice.
Humanity is not immortal so no human can be. As much as it is possible to be immortal, to live beyond death as my grandparent live in me is to pass that DNA on to someone with the wisdom to appreciate their life, and the desire to share that life with children. With all this beauty I can find no better place to spit, and since I am nature spitting on nature it is not such a crime.When they refuse to reproduce they are throwing futility in the face of their parent's desires to find value in life, and to cheat death, and to become immortal.
How did having sex and producing children make you become immortal?
Why do you spit on your True Mother (i.e. Nature) by burying your head in the sands of egotistical love and avoiding knowing her great secret?
A person without children is a perpetual child choosing a toyed ego over a complete existence.
I could just as easily say that a person without wisdom is a "perpetual child choosing a toyed ego over a complete existence". As always, your justifications come from an idealized vacuum and are meaningless.
Which is the greater being - Nature, or a person?
We have one being and different lives.
That one who becomes a link in a chain of life is complete, but only so when his children bury him. You ask if the butterfly is more complete than the chrysalis. Understanding the phases of life is wisdom, and wisdom does, or it is not. Wisdom is the ability to help antlike humanity.Which is the greater act - loving Nature, the Infinite, one's true Mother, or loving a handful of tiny ant-like creatures on a small insignificant planet?
Who is the more complete person - he who opens his entire being to the Infinite and lives freely without any lack, or he who attaches himself to a couple of people and hides away in them?

