Homelessness

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kjones
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Homelessness

Post by kjones » Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:05 am

Dan Rowden wrote:It's interesting that the content of a truly thoughtful person's mind is so readily seen as sufficiently dysfunctional so as to warrant clinical diagnosis. But then, for such people living in countries whose national ethos includes some form of compassion for the ill and aberrant this is a matter of rather good fortune. Life on the streets doesn't appeal.
There are some good things I learnt from my three week experiment with homelessness a month ago. I won't romanticise it, but perhaps some of us will find the information useful:

- women, far more often than men, leave good food in rubbish bins

- women don't like finding strangers in out-of-the-way places, like deserted canyons, and will be the first to make contact to sus one out

- there are no lone "normal" women venturing into such places, and every one of them has a car and companion

- it's not worth reasoning or fighting with a naked drunk man

- exclusively raw food isn't healthy

- the attachment to having a lockable shelter is created by needing to sleep

- it's possible to undergo fairly intense activity with very little food, and remain calm and reasonable

- football grounds are "safe" places in towns to camp in

- it's difficult to display lowliness to people, since having a home and "creature comforts" are assumed to be human characteristics (deviants are suspected of criminality, and the snobbery is very obvious)

- overcoming particular attachments needs lots of reasoning to build up practical plans that one can have faith in, a bit like conscious hypnotism. I gave up the homelessness experiment because my attachment to a lockable shelter was so exhaustingly difficult to overcome, that it was a distraction

- stealing is as difficult as begging, psychologically

- I made some of my silliest financial extravagances, e.g. restaurants, newspapers, cafes, while being homeless

- my thinking became quite idiotic (as the above list shows), despite thinking frequently of Diogenes and Socrates' cynical attitude to comforts

- men were far more open to discussing truth, misogyny and reasoning, while i was perceived as a solo female traveller, and the calibre fell remarkably when i was perceived as a local female (potential gossip)

- cleanliness is a psychological relief

- it's better to relieve the pressure of an attachment that one agonises over, because the mind is freed from the agitation enough to get to know the experience at first hand, and then next time it appears, there is a habit created to take it on with reasoning (a feeling of familiarity and confidence)



Kelly

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Blair
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Post by Blair » Thu Dec 01, 2005 3:15 pm

I admire that you spent 3 weeks homeless, but I don't think it's long enough to truly understand what it's like to give up 'comforts'. You had the option to turn back at any time.

How does the idea of being permanently stranded on a deserted island appeal to you?

kjones
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Post by kjones » Thu Dec 01, 2005 5:36 pm

prince wrote:I admire that you spent 3 weeks homeless, but I don't think it's long enough to truly understand what it's like to give up 'comforts'. You had the option to turn back at any time.
Indeed. Yet it was enough to stimulate a sense of resourcefulness. It gave an idea of the need to approach the philosophical life with the full intention of following through. It also helped me to see the necessity of good planning to ensure the intention can be followed through.

It was like tempering metal. At a certain point, it can't be beaten into shape, and will shatter. So it has to undergo very high temperatures, and then quenched, so the metal structure changes. Then it can be molded to the desired shape. I plan to continue with these sorts of experiments, because on an intuitive level, the hardship stimulates me to push on into feared territory.

I still can't understand the point of frivolity, as I've picked up in the behaviour of Kevin, Sue, Dan, and David, to varying degrees. I know the twists of ego can be extremely funny, and laughing at the absurdity of karma is more creative than complaining. Yet not taking oneself seriously is a superficial form of irony. It fits too easily into today's highly popular culture of fundamentalist laziness.

How does the idea of being permanently stranded on a deserted island appeal to you?
I'm not sure how this relates to homelessness. My aim was not to be a travelling hermit, but to explore the affects of living without a fairly reliable place where i could be comfortable, to integrate intense daily exercise, and distribute the first issue of the Truth Paper.

But since you asked:

Since I'd never know if it were a permanent situation, I'd try to make the best go i could, whilst trying to locate ways off the island. You see, if I suspected other humans were still existing, it would waste my human life not to share what I know.

My immediate concern would be to isolate a good water source, find edible starch foods, and ensure I were fairly comfortable thermally. Unfortunately, this indicates how typically focussed on biological needs I am.

I'd try to hold the thought of Truth as long and often as possible, using my reasoning about choosing a site to defecate, making a shelter, and plans for propagating tubers and other nutrient-rich fast-growing plants, as instances of Truth. In this way, I would be limiting the way I compromised my holy work.

I'd then slowly explore how to continue my existence as healthily as possible with what was available, spending my days deepening my acquaintance with Truth. I'd probably become a very simple creature indeed, eventually. This would take quite a long time, though.


Kelly

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Tomas
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Post by Tomas » Mon Jun 12, 2006 4:27 pm

The ones that kill me are those who stand near a Wal-Mart and hold a sign saying , "they are in transit and in need of food."

If they are heavy into body markings, piercings, etc. ... tend not to give them the time and NOT plunk them some $$$.

If they have some kids in tow, then i'll offer them a ride to a restaurant and pick up the tab. Put 'em up in a motel for a couple days, inquire if they want a job for a few days whatever. You know, put some money in their pockets.

Rather they have a fully tummy and well-rested than depart my town shaking the dirt from feet, cursing that nobody was righteous.

I remember having to hitch-hike a couple times when i was younger (once upon a time) when my car broke down. It's a cold cold world. Having to put a thumb on the wind and wait for the samaritan to reappear one last dance. They always do!

If not, it's the grim reaper and time's up.

It's no fun being an illegal alien. Stranger in a strange land.

Homeless ain't cool -but- it happens.



Tomas (the tank)
VietNam veteran - 1971

unwise
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Post by unwise » Tue Jun 13, 2006 12:48 am

- my thinking became quite idiotic (as the above list shows), despite thinking frequently of Diogenes and Socrates' cynical attitude to comforts
Scavaging for food and survival, constant vigilance, wondering where to defecate, bothering and frightening others, steeling, humiliating oneself, being dirty, cold, hungry, uncomfortable, judging all around you to be crass materialists.......

It's a funny environment to contemplate Diagenes and Socrates. It's a funny place to contemplate anything. That's why most to the thinking in this world has been done by the rich.

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DHodges
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The importance of proper punctuation

Post by DHodges » Tue Jun 13, 2006 4:04 am

Tomas wrote:The ones that kill me are those who stand near a Wal-Mart and hold a sign saying , "they are in transit and in need of food."
That is indeed a bizarre sign.

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Tomas
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Post by Tomas » Wed Jun 14, 2006 9:37 am

Reply to D Hodges

If these "homeless" have a placard that says something to the effect, "Will work for food." ... then it takes on a whole new light.

Also, if the transients have tattoo's, purple hair, smoke cigarettes, etc. -- bye bye!!


Tomas (the tank)
VietNam veteran - 1971

MKFaizi

Post by MKFaizi » Thu Jun 15, 2006 12:22 pm

I have always given money to homeless people -- more so when I lived in Baltimore City. Did not matter to me that they were winos looking for the next bottle.

Last summer, I took my daughter and two of her friends to Virginia Beach for one night. Impulsive thing. No plan. The motel room cost an arm and a leg or two. The kids spent a wad of money on bullshit.

Going home, I asked if they could give me any gas money. I was not sure that I would make it all the way back to Buchanan without some contribution. Neither of the two guest kids were willing to help. I stopped at a gas station and they went in and bought snacks.

Cool.

I made it to Charlottesville and was below empty. I said, "You have to panhandle. Tell 'em we have no money for gas."

Over three stops, the kids got a buck between 'em. I could not believe the people who utterly refused to give even a quarter. I would have given a kid five bucks. No purple hair or tatoos or piercings.

I made the three and a half hour drive to Buchanan on a dollar of gas. Good ol' Nissan. I gave out of gas completely about a mile from home. I was thankful to have gotten off the interstate before it broke down. Called someone with a gas can.

The two guest girls bailed at that point. Took a ride with the person who brought the gas.

My daughter agreed with me that her friends were two brats. Had they given up two bucks apiece, we would have made it home no problem.

They expect to be cared for and pampered. Parents are supposed to pay for everything while they just get what they want.

Cool -- except I had no money.

My daughter worked starting on her sixteenth birthday. She has had it better than some kids because her aunts and uncles have given her things. But she knows the value of a dollar because she has had to earn it.

I do have empathy for street people -- no matter what their signs say or whether or not they have purple hair. I will always give anyone who asks me a buck. A dollar is not a lot to me. I don't care if they are going to spend it on wine or heroin or food. You need a buck, you need a buck.

Been in the same fix. I know how it feels and all I needed was gas money home.

Give it up, people.

Faizi

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Post by unwise » Thu Jun 15, 2006 12:35 pm

They expect to be cared for and pampered. Parents are supposed to pay for everything while they just get what they want.
This is how I feel about blokes on the dole and other bums. I don't give bums shit.

You should be ashamed to take kids under your wing without the proper preparation. Are you mental? Adults like you teach kids to be bums. Those two brats did the right thing. Why give their money to a bum? They got out of there as fast as they could because they thought you were crazy.

All bums should get off their ass or resort to family and friends for their support. I don't pay for this shit. It's bad karma to be down and out and refuse to help yourself. It is also bad karma to support it and to enable it to continue. It creates weakness and deterioration of society.

I see bums everyday in Seattle. I see the same bums year after year. With the time they put in to looking sad out there with their sign, they could get some shit together and provide for themselves. Many of them are wanted and running from the law. Many owe child support of have children they have abandoned.

No wonder you support the QVC.

MKFaizi

Post by MKFaizi » Thu Jun 15, 2006 1:02 pm

The agreement was that everyone would help pay. They wanted to go to the beach. I would rather have stayed at home. They begged me to take them. I told them that they would have to pay for gas.

I am not a bum. I work very hard for a living. I work five nine hour days. Not a lot of overtime but the reason I have to do it is because the rest of my office is part time. Married women.

I did not take these kids under my wing. I told them up front that I would need money to take them to the beach.

I was not asking for gas money because I am a bum. I am a LPN who works for a doctor. I have been a single mother since my younger child was two months old.

The one guest girl is the daughter of a truck driver and a waitress. They have a couple of Harleys apiece. The other girl is not as well moneyed but does better than I do -- child support.

I did not teach these girls to be bums. I asked them for gas money so they could get home -- that was the agreement -- I paid the bulk -- all I needed from them was two bucks apiece. They refused. They chose to spend the two bucks on popcorn instead. These girls were not ten year olds. Seventeen.

My daughter who has worked since she was barely sixteen understood that I needed gas money. The agreement for the trip was that everyone would contribute. I contributed heavily.

All I asked was two bucks apiece for gasoline. They each chose not to pay for gas.

I was not the bum. They wanted to go to the beach and I agreed to take them if they could give me gas money.

Interesting that you can tell me that I teach kids to be bums when my daughter has worked for two years. I work very hard for a meager living. I do teach my kids to do what they say they will do. If someone else takes my kid to the beach, my kid pays her/his way.

Faizi[/url]

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Blair
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Post by Blair » Thu Jun 15, 2006 1:21 pm

That's mental. Even if you didn't expect to use it, you should have had cash to back you up, otherwise don't undertake such a thing. Otherwise you will, as unwise said, appear like a crazy fucktard.

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Post by unwise » Thu Jun 15, 2006 1:30 pm

You acted like a chaotic fucktard. You are supposed to be a sane, organized adult. It's OK to ask the kids for some gas money if they were 17. If they were 12 it would NOT be OK to ask for gas money. However, you should have said, "Give me the fucking gas money right now or we are going nowhere."

How hard it that? You act like a dingbat who is hoping that her crystal ball or personal angel is going to get the car home OK.

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Post by Tharan » Fri Jun 16, 2006 11:28 am

Or rather she is acting like a caring person who was hoping to please and then not ruining the entire trip by yelling at her daughter's friends. I understand it.

But actually, girls are tough little bitches. They will both take advantage if they can and rebound if they are scolded.

MKFaizi

Post by MKFaizi » Fri Jun 16, 2006 12:49 pm

All right, I am a fucktard.

However, the agreement was that I would take them to the beach if they helped me with gas. I had no money. I have no charge cards. I told them, "I have no money. You will have to help with gas." I asked them for two bucks each. They chose to buy popcorn instead. Well, that was their choice. You make a choice, you take the consequences. You embarrass yourself by having to go up to complete strangers and ask for money.

I definitely was not trying to be kind to these girls nor was I trying to be mean. I told them I was poor and broke. My daughter knows what that means. The other girls did not. They whined, "You mean, you don't have a charge card?"

Well, no, I don't. When I say I don't have money, I don't have money.

Now, they know. I reckon they will never ask me to take them to the beach again.

Cool.

Faizi

MKFaizi

Post by MKFaizi » Fri Jun 16, 2006 1:09 pm

I am not an organized adult. Ever since my kids were born and their father died shortly thereafter -- kind of like a worker bee -- my life has been chaos. Often, in single parenthood -- if you are female -- people assume that you have no life and, therefore, can raise their kids, too. My house was the "neighborhood house." I always had ten to twenty five kids -- all from about two to ten. Several stayed here for several nights at a time. I fed them and bathed them. A couple even stayed here when they had chicken pox.

Once, I had about thirty kids in my back yard at once. I had an electronic bullhorn for crowd control. I sat on the deck and spoke out commands and scoldings and corrections -- "You, on the swing, stop poking the boy in the neck." "You -- in the sandbox -- no throwing sand, please." "Jacob Black, Jacob Black, get down from the top of the swingset." "Rock Faizi, stop choking your brother. Rock Faizi, stop choking your brother."

Often, ten or eleven would spend the night and we all slept in the same bed. Me, two dogs, four cats and eleven kids. We would sing Jim Morrison and Bob Dylan to go to sleep. Such a sweet voiced choir singing. "There's a killer on the road." or "The time's they are a changin" or "It's all right, ma" or "take me disappearin through the smokerings of my mind."

Then, I had to come up with breakfast for eleven in the morning. Pancakes, oatmeal; pop tarts, cereal. Sometimes, this was on a school night so I had to get them up and ready and take them to school, too.

God, I am glad those days are over.

If I had it to do over again, I would not have raised kids in a neighborhood. I would have lived out of town, secluded.

Faizi

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Post by unwise » Fri Jun 16, 2006 1:31 pm

"John Stillwater!!! How can you have any pudding if you don't eat your meat!!!!!"

This is great. The thought of you out there with your bullhorn sort of turns me on.

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Post by sschaula » Fri Jun 16, 2006 1:46 pm

Nemo, you sort of disgust me.
- Scott

MKFaizi

Post by MKFaizi » Fri Jun 16, 2006 2:08 pm

Well, one minute, I'm a fucktard. Next minute, my bullhorn turns you on.

Here is my suggestion. Go pick up a twenty something babe at a biker bar and buy her an electronic bullhorn. Rent thirty kids from the age of two to ten and let the good times roll.

Props you need: Swing set, sand box, toys used as weapons.

Set the broad out on a deck with the bullhorn and take your binoculars off to some distance and get a big Viagra hardon watching her go head to head with thirty kids.

Kind of like a Civil War re-enactment.

Faizi

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Post by unwise » Fri Jun 16, 2006 4:08 pm

haha.

Nice.

MKFaizi

Post by MKFaizi » Fri Jun 16, 2006 4:16 pm

Then, do it.

And post pictures.

Faizi

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