The Metaphysical Dream of the World

[Alex Jacob]

Also Alex, just write less. Hearing me? Write less so you stop bullshitting yourself.

And Dan! Why do you persist on talking to Pincho/Alex or anyone who you know is the same after repetition?

If it really is because you care that little, congratulations, you really are outdoing me and I need a course in whatever you got.

If in lengthy writing I am bullshitting myself, how would writing less eliminate or modify that? When one is bullshitting, it starts with the smallest parts, you know what I mean?

Are you aware that your sentences are badly constructed? The base of all writing---good writing---is a carefully constructed sentence. The better the sentences---the more precise, organized and efficient---the better is the whole piece of writing.

Your first sentence is not tight enough. I understand you but it is a slightly disorganized cluster. Your second gets incoherent with 'who you know is the same after repetition'. The third sentence is also a little incoherent.

While I would not say that you are 'bullshitting' yourself (since the deluded have no ground to pass judgment on the enlightened!), the way you write weakens the ideas you wish to communicate. In my view.

[SeekerOfWisdom]

Which ideas did me try and communicate ae? Besides that my name is John, you write a lot of bullshit, and that Dan shouldn't waste his time repeating himself to you. To me view it all came out pretty clearly.

[Diebert van Rhijn]

But it's fine for him because his whole agenda is fitting shit he doesn't "like" into his own framework.

The thing is that the philosophical is not on the agenda with him. That's an illusion. There is not really some owned "framework" either although I thought there was too. The agenda which does operate here is completely alien to you and me. But very prevalent! Alex might realize this and translates that as us being "babes" for that reason. Although he still does not know why it's alien. Well, you figure out the rest! As if you'd care of course.

[Tomas]

I'm not yet 100% convinced there's no possibility of him seeing that, and that his modus operandi makes him irrelevant to this place. Maybe I just want to be surprised when one of these days he says something about my worldview that's actually recognisable to me. Maybe it's a substitute for Xmas or something. Give me that bike you promised, dammit!

Admit it, the both of you.

Music is your outlet.

You two would be the perfect karaoke duet over at the Wednesday Night Club in Brisbane.

Drop a hat in front of your platform and I'd toss in some $$$.

I know Dan has a good voice by way of his podcasts and Alex is forever sending YouTube material our way. He either hums along or sings in his sleep.

[Alex Jacob]

Diebert: Another strategy in The Game: make an assertion that the very structure of a person's ideas is invalid and not to be taken seriously. It does not matter if it is true or not, the *declaration* is what matters. It is then shared with others as in this case expressed with third person distance. The manoeuvre has been played within this group from 'time immemorial'.

Specific systems of philosophy are not indeed my interest or concern. On one hand the whole question of religion, religious attitude, is essentially what interests me. How a person orients himself in respect to his Metaphysical Dream. What sort of person he becomes, what he does. And I suppose that I think that nearly every philosophical concern that one could have, or religious concern if you will, has been expressed in Platonic writing, such that, as they say, everything else is 'footnote', but that Platonic writing is a conversation that one enters into, a flame or spirit that arises between two people who speak about what they are living right now, and the possibilities of life, what has value and worth and relevancy, that this might define my philosophical relationship, and in my view this is right where one should be.

But game playing and power-trips and shenanigans of various philosophical Bossy Boots---I would place that in the camp of sophistry: what we don't want to be doing. Or what should be exposed.

[Alex Jacob]

Which ideas did me try and communicate ae? Besides that my name is John, you write a lot of bullshit, and that Dan shouldn't waste his time repeating himself to you. To me view it all came out pretty clearly.

Hmmmm. An enlightened teenage Aussie Rasta! You could bring The Dharma to the gurgling masses if you came up with a shtick similar to Matisyahu! Do you rap? Heh heh.

You have said that what I write is bullshit, but what specifically is bullshit? Can you give one example of something that you are certain is thorough bullshit?

[Kunga]

Do you try to impress others ? I know you love to write, as all writers do....but it seems to me, you are trying also to impress others with all that you know: [literature, history, whatever...] That's the stuff of bullshit.

Also, I think if we were all really intelligent here, there would be more understanding of each other, dispite the differences in expressions of thoughts.... I am disappointed in the so-called geniuses here, that they have a hard time comprehending the logic and even abstract logic of everyone. The ability to comprehend the difficult and abstract, should be easy for a genius.

As much as we communicate here....little is actually communicated. Only the insults are clear.
And to forgo compassion as a sign of weakness or stupidity [in favor of intelligence], is pure evil.

Heart problems are a common ailment to those who block the natural feelings of love and replace them with hatred and loathing.

[Leyla Shen]

Jacob wrote:
Diebert: Another strategy in The Game: make an assertion that the very structure of a person's ideas is invalid and not to be taken seriously. It does not matter if it is true or not, the *declaration* is what matters. It is then shared with others as in this case expressed with third person distance.

You might be taken seriously if you stopped proving people right even as you declare them to be wrong:

Jacob wrote
Specific systems of philosophy are not indeed my interest or concern. On one hand the whole question of religion, religious attitude, is essentially what interests me. How a person orients himself in respect to his Metaphysical Dream. What sort of person he becomes, what he does. And I suppose that I think that nearly every philosophical concern that one could have, or religious concern if you will, has been expressed in Platonic writing, such that, as they say, everything else is 'footnote', but that Platonic writing is a conversation that one enters into, a flame or spirit that arises between two people who speak about what they are living right now, and the possibilities of life, what has value and worth and relevancy, that this might define my philosophical relationship, and in my view this is right where one should be.

Diebert wrote:
The thing is that the philosophical is not on the agenda with him. That's an illusion. There is not really some owned "framework" either although I thought there was too. The agenda which does operate here is completely alien to you and me. But very prevalent! Alex might realize this and translates that as us being "babes" for that reason. Although he still does not know why it's alien. Well, you figure out the rest! As if you'd care of course.

[Leyla Shen]

Fucking, duh.

[Alex Jacob]

Kunga, Americans are deeply 'anti-intellectual' and since the general American attitude has taken over the whole world it is not surprising that there is a general anti-intellectual attitude prevalent among many people. There is also the aspect of illiteracy: no interest in 'our own traditions' and lack of energy to find out. If you were inclined to intimidation you would describe my efforts as 'trying to impress' but it is more in the spirit of 'trying to share' things---ideas, writings, quotes---that *have value*. The culture around us, for many different reasons, is dominated by concerns of appetite or image or pure sensuality, and in that environment the 'intellectual' simply has no place. I would place you, Kunga, somewhat in John's camp (as I understand it): you shoot down what you do not understand, what you have no desire or need to understand. But please don't take that as an aggressive statement against you (or him). One thing that Diebert often says: That I am interested in intellectual subjects or have intellectual concerns (qualified, of course, as 'pseudo-intellectual!), but that this place 'isn't much interested in that'. That's true. And that is a defect. (Interestingly, in the Elizabethan concept 'intellect' is literally that part of the human being that connects us with 'the angelic': that is to say beings of pure thought beyond the 'sublunary realm'. I only mention it---as a symbol or image---because if we surrender intellect and intellectuality I think we are cutting ourselves off from really great and really important things in our own nature, of our capabilities. To recover wholeness and full capability as persons I think we have to advance on all fronts: intellectual, emotional, intuitive, physical. I question (and often ridicule) the designations of 'bullshit' and 'delusion' and 'false' that are used by the blokes here. But again, it all has to do with what a person ultimately values.

[Kunga]

Americans are deeply 'anti-intellectual'

I already went through that phase of my life [as a teen /intellectual].
Now, i have no interest in elaborations.
I just want to get to the point.

The intellectual is like the stuff of fluff to me.
Condense the fluff to the essence...

Write a haiku for fun :)

[Alex Jacob]

Fucking, duh.

One very basic rule---here but really in any context---never give over to another the complete authority to define you. But specifically, here, *definitions* of others, especially when two persons have become antagonistic, are used as weapons or as a means to increase the already-present polarization. In regards to Diebert's statement I made an effort to 'agree' with him in one sense but then to qualify it according to my understanding of my own endeavor. The mistake is yours to assume I was trying to negate what he said. The 'owned framework' part is the area of difference, but since almost everything I write arises from that (albeit) loose framework, I don't see much need to restate it.

Leyla, every once in a while I wonder if your brain is not running a fever. A good exercise for hotheads is to literally run cold water over the head and to breathe nice, clean, cool air.

[Alex Jacob]

I just want to get to the point.

Sometimes you can't get to the point if you don't understand at least some part of how one has gotten to a point-to-be-made. All of our ideas have a genesis, a causal history to put it in GF terms. I think there are many different modalities through which to live life and it is hard to say that one is better than another. But I am also inclined, now more than before, to believe that 'we' need to reclaim a specific structure of ideation and not to forget how to engage intellectually and of course rationally. I don't buy the argument---if it is an argument, it is more like the dropping of having an argument---that intellectual skill is passé or a thing of 'youth' or 'delusion'. Again, 'we' have to advance and claim, and hold, ground on many levels in that sense to *battle* the encroaching, inane present.

[Alex Jacob]

The best I could come up with on the spur of the moment:

• What-the-fuck
  Fucking, duh
  A dog humps his bride-to-be.

[Kunga]

Sometimes you can't get to the point if you don't understand at least some part of how one has gotten to a point-to-be-made.

But we don't need to hear the whole history of Greek mythology, to make the point. Assume we already know it. We can figure things out on our own. If clarification is needed, we will ask.

Also, when I was a voracious reader, [sometimes read 4-5 books at a time], the books that held my interest were not the fluffy ones, that bored me to tears....but the ones that had someting to say that was relevant in each sentence.

I was never a reader of fiction, unless it was an exceptional classic. I hate novels. I only read to learn facts. Biographies are one of my favorites.

Now reading bores me to death. So make it interesting.

[Kunga]

The best I could come up with on the spur of the moment:

• What-the-fuck
  Fucking, duh
  A dog humps his bride-to-be.

lol

try condensing a long deep intellectual thought
into a haiku now.

the fucking haiku wasn't deep enough

[Alex Jacob]

First, one must take into account the deep psychic anxiety, the extraordinary prevalence of neurosis, which makes our age unique. The typical modern has the look of the hunted. He senses that we have lost our grip upon reality. This, in turn, produced disintegration, and disintegration leaves impossible that kind of reasonable prediction by which men, in eras of sanity, are able to order their lives.

In my view, Diebert, the *thing* we all face and deal with---or don't---is this. How we come to grips with this, how we order or reorder our lives in the face of what *that* implies, is the the real thing we are involved in, or should be. You and QRS generally have a relationship to that issue, certainly, but what you recommend ultimately is where we seem to differ.

[Alex Jacob]

try condensing a long deep intellectual thought

Nah. Best to start with short, shallow, vain and pseudo-intellectual henids!

So make it interesting.

That's often to write for the lowest common denominator!

[Kunga]

sorry....i asked you to write for fun...and you did...

_/\_


it was fun-ny

[Tomas]

I'm not yet 100% convinced there's no possibility of him seeing that, and that his modus operandi makes him irrelevant to this place. Maybe I just want to be surprised when one of these days he says something about my worldview that's actually recognisable to me. Maybe it's a substitute for Xmas or something. Give me that bike you promised, dammit!

Admit it, the both of you.

Music is your outlet.

You two would be the perfect karaoke duet over at the Wednesday Night Club in Brisbane.

Drop a hat in front of your platform and I'd toss in some $$$.

I know Dan has a good voice by way of his podcasts and Alex is forever sending YouTube material our way. He either hums along or sings in his sleep.

I would add that Alex must be an ugly American.

[Alex Jacob]

The original novel from which the title is taken is actually a protest novel (of sorts) of hubristic American attitudes that got us into a whole mess of trouble. The Ugly American. The ugly American of the novel is actually an admirable figure.

[Diebert van Rhijn]

Another strategy in The Game: make an assertion that the very structure of a person's ideas is invalid and not to be taken seriously. It does not matter if it is true or not, the *declaration* is what matters.It is then shared with others as in this case expressed with third person distance.

Well, I was responding to Dan and his in my view wrong assumption that Santa Claus is real. He'll find out for him self, obviously. Or he could read back the old discussions I had with you! It's this thing with the eternal flywheel of suffering I guess that sparks this idea of putting something between the spokes at certain times.

Of course I wrote hundreds of posts explaining how the imagined structure and content in your critique was invalid or missing. What you do is skipping them, denying them, brushing it all off and not allowing my conclusion to be voiced now, even by myself to anyone else! If you disagree with them it's alright but do not pretend now it's just "declaration". You just do not care if anything "is true or not" after all. What you care about is attitude, orientation and your own feeling of that moment. All the rest you just prefer to trash.

Go find yourself another "talking ass"!

[Alex Jacob]

DON'T GET ME GOING about Santa Claus again! Don't!

[Leyla Shen]

On The Metaphysical Wet Dreams of Alexis

And I would take any sort of advice from you why, exactly, Alexis Loose Lips? I have a genuine, tight pussy; don't need to flap toothless gums around to get attention.

[Tomas]

On The Metaphysical Wet Dreams of Alexis

And I would take any sort of advice from you why, exactly, Alexis Loose Lips? I have a genuine, tight pussy; don't need to flap toothless gums around to get attention.

Whoa!

If I didn't have a wife I'd insert a happy face...