The Neurological Deficiency Caused by Enlightenment

[Ryan Rudolph]

It seems to me that one’s short-term memory degenerates a bit, as one becomes trained to analyze the totality through vast long-term trends that require very little short-term retention, and so the brain naturally allocates more brain maps to what is being done most of the time. Moreover, the solution should be to re-train the neo-cortex to remember small trivial things over the short-term. And since the neo-cortex is plastic, it shouldn’t be a problem to retrain it to be able to accomplish both tasks simultaneously.

So the enlightened person is not exempt from rules of brain plasticity, meaning the skills one uses the most will be strengthened, while the skills that are ignored will shrink out of existence, as the brain is in competition with itself to allocate brain maps to whatever types of cognition are being used the most. The ideal consciousness would be one that is capable of analyzing vast long-term patterns over a significant span of time, while still being able to analyze small trivial details, and retain them over the short term.

The reason why some conscious people find trivial empirical details boring/uninteresting is because all their brain maps have been rewired to only tolerate what they have been doing for years…which is much more macro than micro. Boring is another word for difficult to learn meaning there are no brain maps established for that type of task.

[Steven Coyle]

Good info, Ryan.

I was a little worried about my short-term-retention, but I think you make a good point here. Judging by my brain's plasticity in matters of spiritual knowledge, I foresee attention to trival matters as a potential key. I'm guessing in order to switch tracks between the two - as even right now I'm busy working on a design project - I could switch from a dual to non-dual brain map? (guess I'm kinda doing that anyway)

Or how would one properly integrate spiritual and trival...?

[maestro]

Enlightenment is the end of stress, trivial pursuits being discarded the mind should become sharper in all aspects.

[Steven Coyle]

True, but in this context there's a difference between trivia and trivial.

[Ryan Rudolph]

Steven wrote:

Or how would one properly integrate spiritual and trival...?

Well, it is easier to study the spiritual because it feels more important, and it comes more naturally, whereas the trivial feels less important, and comes less naturally because the brain has become solely specialized for spiritual matters. There are probably no brain maps there to handle that type of skill, and so it feels uncomfortable, pointless, and boring.

In schools - To motivate children to learn difficult subjects, a reward system is established so that the child's passion fuels the restructuring of their brains. Without the passion, the child is far too bored and uncomfortable to learn anything new.

So it seems to me that one would have to see/feel certain types of trivial empirical matters as important, by seeing what they give rise to, and how they complement wisdom. For instance: studying electronics and robotics is incredibly tedious, and requires quite a bit of memorization of trivial information, which doesn’t come naturally to those immersed in the infinite for decades. However, the neocortex is not fixed, and I believe that perhaps if one feels that certain empirical studies are also important in conjunction with wisdom, then ones passion can fuel the restructuring of the neocortex to share its brain maps with both wisdom, and the empirical.

Maestro wrote:

Enlightenment is the end of stress, trivial pursuits being discarded the mind should become sharper in all aspects.

It should be, it would be nice, but it doesn’t. The truth is that the minds of enlightened individuals are lacking in some ways, especially short-term memory retention. Brain Plasticity doesn’t necessarily favor the enlightened. The neural net inside the brain is in competition with itself, meaning brain maps are allocated for the types of cognition done the most, and so some areas will be neglected, and left out. Passion seems like the only motivator to cause a restructuring of the brain maps.

[maestro]

The truth is that the minds of enlightened individuals are lacking in some ways, especially short-term memory retention. Brain Plasticity doesn’t necessarily favor the enlightened. The neural net inside the brain is in competition with itself, meaning brain maps are allocated for the types of cognition done the most, and so some areas will be neglected, and left out

How are you so sure. What do you mean by short term memory, like what did I have for breakfast?

[Ryan Rudolph]

Maestro wrote:

How are you so sure. What do you mean by short term memory, like what did I have for breakfast?

I’m using the words short-term memory, as it relates to empirical sciences, like remembering all the tedious parts of a process, a theory, or all the parts of a machine, and how they relate - such as remembering something technical in psychology such as the mechanics of a neuron. Technical knowledge in the sciences requires both the short-term and long-term memory. One has to be able to retain a large number of tiny empirical facts from what one has read in the short-term until one understands what is happening through a larger framework, and then transfer it into the more long-term memory.

The skill is primarily done by the neocortex, but also involves other parts of the brain. However, if all ones brain maps have been allocated for visualizing larger vast processes with a smaller number of causal components, then the short-term memory becomes less able to retain and piece together large numbers of empirical entities for understanding the micro-processes. The minds of some enlightened individuals seem to have a weaker short-term retaining process, and so they have difficulty keeping all the facts suspended in memory until they understand, and then after one understands something technical, it needs to be stored into the long term memory, which can be a difficulty for some as well.

I’m just suggesting that perhaps the neocortex can be re-trained for some of these specialized empirical tasks, given that the brain is plastic, and subject to change, if the passion is there.

[maestro]

All I can say is that you are indulging in pure speculation. Being free of delusion does not entail all this.

[Ryan Rudolph]

Maestro,

All I can say is that you are indulging in pure speculation. Being free of delusion does not entail all this.

No, what I’m saying is grounded in the certainty of empirical science, and perhaps you are just overwhelmed by the possibility that even the most enlightened among us are grossly inadequate compared to what is actually possible for a sentient being.

[maestro]

No, what I’m saying is grounded in the certainty of empirical science,

Can you post a link to the empirical study in question.

[Ryan Rudolph]

well, there isn't one empirical study as such, but the science behind much of what I'm saying is from the book: "The Brain That Changes Itself" By Norman Doidge, and his documentation on the latest breakthroughs in Brain Plasticity is widely accepted by the psychological community.

All I'm basically saying is that even the enlightened mind becomes incredibly specialized, and there are negative neurological affects to specialization, and in the sage's case - an inability to retain large amounts of empirical data in the short-term or long-term memory seem to be a common occurrence And the theory is that this occurs because the neocortex only has so much brain space to allocate, and so brain maps are favored to the types of cognition that are done the most, while the other types suffer.

An example is Einstein, certain mathematical and analytical parts of his brain were enlarged to grotesque proportions, while others were shrunk out of existence. This is probably one of the reasons why he was very clumsy, awkward, and spatially inept.

A contrasting example would be an athlete, whose specialization has resulted in much of his brain maps being allocated to the perfection of physical movement in his sport...while his spiritual maturity has been ignored.

The end result is someone that can run circles around any philosopher, and outdo them in any sport, but when asked to give a simple philosophical definition, they become confused, and circumvent the question. That is brain plasticity at work...

http://www.normandoidge.com/

[maestro]

Your point is that having developing particular skills very well can cause other skills to suffer. Even if I grant that, is enlightenment a skill? Is not enlightenment the realization of oneness with the universe and the nonexistence of self, and the consequent end of suffering. There seems to be nothing that would cause short term memory to suffer.

[Ryan Rudolph]

Maestro wrote:

Even if I grant that, is enlightenment a skill? Is not enlightenment the realization of oneness with the universe and the nonexistence of self, and the consequent end of suffering. There seems to be nothing that would cause short term memory to suffer.

In a sense, I would suggest that enlightenment involves a certain type of skill – namely a certain type of cognition – The type of cognition necessary for enlightenment is based on pattern recognition or predictions over a long-term span. One thoughts are skipping over reality making large swooping generalizations and conclusions similar to a small spider skipping overly the entire ocean’s surface in a very short time. The analyses are always psychological in nature, and involve vast spatial sequences of relationships. This is a totally different type of cognition compared to humans that are specialized in analyzing small tiny empirical details, and coming up with new pragmatic theories to manipulate reality.

And so I’m saying is that the brain competes for brain maps, and that enlightenment favors the above type of cognition over the other. Its not really a problem if you don’t believe it is a problem, but if you are also interested in empirical sciences such as Chemistry or Robotics, then your studies will suffer until you re-train your neo-cortex to be able to analyze through the micro… rather than just the macro all the time.

Basically, Brain plasticity works according to the principle - "if you don't use it, you lose it" However, I don't believe the loss has to be permanent.

[maestro]

I think you are mistaken, for example I study mathematics. And to gain knowledge in this area you have to begin with taking in bits of information, which do not gel in together at once, but slowly as your subconscious works on it they gel in together and then it forms one coherent beautiful whole.

Similar is the case with enlightenment, you being by taking bits of philosophy and bits of self observations. They will not gel in together, but let the process brew for some years and it will all fall in place. Here as in mathematics or physics, the process of Gnosis works the same way.

[mikiel]

Your point is that having developing particular skills very well can cause other skills to suffer. Even if I grant that, is enlightenment a skill? Is not enlightenment the realization of oneness with the universe and the nonexistence of self, and the consequent end of suffering. There seems to be nothing that would cause short term memory to suffer.

What he said.
Enlightenment is not about content of consciousness, what one knows about the world and all its complexity but the radical realization that I Am this awareness itself, completely transcending what I am aware of.
This "what" includes who I thought I was as defined by all known worldly parameters and egoic/robotic programing.
This is the meaning of the Truth which sets one free... in the ultimate sense of both Truth and Freedom.

Genius is more about what one knows, including the above distinction between knowing "stuff" and knowing True Identity.
Enlightenment is strictly the latter. I Am Consciousness... One with no boundary or locus.

mikiel

[divine focus]

As I see it, the particulars dealt with by the self-aware are less tangible and more "nebulous" or esoteric in nature, although still very specific. There is a greater tie-in between the particular and the general such that both are held in mind at once. The particular is then not seen as a way to the general but a way to expand the general. As such, the particular is not given undue importance since the general is already known. The expansion of the general is not necessary in terms of trying to by focusing on the particular but instead happens naturally and effortlessly. There's no stopping the expansion.

[Steven Coyle]

Nexus of the all, plus the right formulas for talent, replicates genius (spirit). Higher spiritual knowledge is genius, or one definintion of it anyway. There one unearths the soul, their own story - their own knowledge creating new languages out from gnosis.

[Ryan Rudolph]

Maestro wroteL

I think you are mistaken, for example I study mathematics. And to gain knowledge in this area you have to begin with taking in bits of information, which do not gel in together at once, but slowly as your subconscious works on it they gel in together and then it forms one coherent beautiful whole.

Similar is the case with enlightenment, you being by taking bits of philosophy and bits of self observations. They will not gel in together, but let the process brew for some years and it will all fall in place. Here as in mathematics or physics, the process of Gnosis works the same way.

Lets analyze the differences: Seeing truth philosophically requires an immediate visualization of psychological/logical relationships within the totality, and how those relationships either impede or liberate the individual.

On the other hand, mathematics is a little different, it involves abstract representations using numbers, meaning numbers represent things, and one has to solve problems by imagining how those things relate mathematically. And one’s mathematics is governed by his understanding of its rules, syntax, operations and so on. Not visualizing how the abstract numerical things relate properly or not putting something in the right order in an equation, or using the wrong symbol, or not understanding what certain mathematical symbols mean in relationship results in an incorrect answer. In my opinion, mathematics is fairly different from reasoning. There are more tedious things that can go wrong in mathematics.

Mathematics seems a bit more complicated , whereas reasoning when mastered is fairly simple and elegant.

It would be interesting to study which parts of the brain are being used when one is reasoning something out philosophically compared to when one is working through a complicated mathematical problem on paper – I would bet it involves different parts of the brain altogether.

[maestro]

Actually philosophy and mathematics are quite similar. Using small logical steps and precise definitions (axioms) one makes deductions. In fact each field of mathematics has its own specialized language which is very formal and unambiguous, while philosophy is done using the mundane language, thus philosophy is less rigorous than mathematics, this gives it wider latitude for enquiry but at their core they are essentially the same.

As for enlightenment, philosophy is used for clarifying the thought process and making a correct model of the world. But it is definitely not enough, the emotions and psychology needs to be tackled too. Mere logic is not enough.

[brokenhead]

Ryan, there may be something a bit simpler at work here. Enlightenment may not itself be a cause of the degeneration of short-term memory, but both might be effects of the same thing. When you realize that any kind of enlightenment is a result of effort and repeated work, it is easy to see that it takes time. Time also results in the natural physical process of aging. Aging causes deterioration of short-term memory even in the unenlightened.

The enlightened and unenlightened alike are subject to the use-it-or-lose-it law. You find yourself fall into routines, and routines can also be ruts. Consciously varying your routines helps a great deal, as does developing enough good habits to give bad ones little room to encroach.

Bad habits such as drinking and smoking lead to a diminution of mental acuity as well as physical health. I quit the first almost 4 years ago and the second over 2 years ago. This was due to increasing complications like a pesky DUI and a couple of stints in ICU because of a ruptured ulcer. My heart stopped while I was in ICU - they told me I flatlined for almost a minute. Let me tell you that if your heart is going to quit on you, there can be few better places for it to happen. They had a pacemaker slapped in within 24 hours. (That was premature, IMO, because I have never needed it. It is turned all the way down. As a result, it doesn't take care of me, I have to take care of it, since it is wired to my ticker. I want it removed, but my cardiologist avoids answering me when I ask if this is possible. It is possible, but he'll never order it, because it would open him up to liability like a sitting duck. But that's another story...)

In addition to quitting alcohol and cigarettes, I also began a regular workout schedule - the schedule being the regular thing, the routine something I deliberately vary. I began to pay strict attention to my diet. All the meds I was taking for blood pressure and cholesterol and mood have been discontinued one by one. I noticed those long eye-brow hairs that the 50's bring on are still coming in, but they are no longer gray. In fact, I pulled out a head hair that was only half-gray - the half that contained the root was dark brown, my old color. I calculated the amount of time that the color had returned, and it dated back to the time I quit smoking. I read instead of watching TV, and do the NY Times crossword every day for the short-term memory.

I think what I am trying to say here the good things of youth can be retained and even strengthened when you stop taking things for granted. Both our physical as well as mental selves have a good deal of "plasticity" to them. But a block of clay is quite plastic, too. This means very little unless someone works it and shapes it.

As an interesting study of short-term retention, I recently picked up the guitar again after many years of not playing. I used to play at least an hour every day. At first, it was completely depressing. But instead of quitting at that point as I had a few times over the years, I just played through it. I watched in amazement as my hands would get further into a piece each time I started it. I had no mental concept of the piece at all or any of the parts of it - it was as if the memory were entirely in my hands and I was a spectator. Each time I sat down to play, more of the song would appear as if on its own, and larger chunks showed up at a time. Then other pieces began to appear in their entirety, as if learning one automatically meant knowing another. The reality proved that what had been depressing at the outset had been unfounded: I did not have to learn to play all over again. Things that I didn't know were in my long term memory anymore were actually there, and were being transferred or copied to my short-term memory, so that from day to day, it was not lost. A little practice had enormous results. Within two weeks, I was actually playing some passages more fluently than I ever had.

Our minds are much more plastic and much less limited than we fear, as a little effort clearly demonstrates.

[Relo]

Ah yes, I'm still searching for my map that I lost long ago, before the timing of my birth. I'll eventually find it I'm sure of it.

[Ryan Rudolph]

Brokenhead wrote:

I think what I am trying to say here the good things of youth can be retained and even strengthened when you stop taking things for granted. Both our physical as well as mental selves have a good deal of "plasticity" to them. But a block of clay is quite plastic, too. This means very little unless someone works it and shapes it

.

The reason I say this is because over the last few months I’ve taken up a job at an automobile collision center, and I work in an entry level office position where lots of information is thrown at me continuously, but the information is very difficult to retain because I’m not all that interested in it, plus the information is only temporarily important to the business, so one remembers it for a day, or a week, and then discards it, and starts the whole cycle over again. And my brain is having a difficult time adapting to the environment, as I’m so used to just using my mind to retain more important information that is relevant forever, so as a result I need to keep a notepad all the time just to be able to remember everything that needs to be done for the day.

However, in high school, before I was conscious at all, I was quite good at getting 90s and 100s on tests because my neo-cortex was well adapted to the temporary memorization of information, but over decades of philosophical study, solitude and emptiness, I believe I will need to train part of the cortex to at least be semi average at short term memorization, as I seemed to have lost much of that skill….

[DHodges]

However, in high school, before I was conscious at all, I was quite good at getting 90s and 100s on tests because my neo-cortex was well adapted to the temporary memorization of information, but over decades of philosophical study, solitude and emptiness, I believe I will need to train part of the cortex to at least be semi average at short term memorization, as I seemed to have lost much of that skill….

This is just what happens to the brain as it ages - it loses its plasticity, and short term memory takes more work. It probably doesn't have much to do with philosophy, just biology.

There's nothing wrong with using a notepad.

[Carl G]

I find that the best way to forget something is to write it down. And long lists of "to do" are a good way to assure that things don't get done. Best is to simplify one's life, but of course, in some lines of work, writing down is essential. Too much data, it's the modern curse, but hey, we're in modern times.

[brokenhead]

I find that the best way to forget something is to write it down

Same here. But that's because I forget where I wrote it down.